Public Sector Strikes

[outragous76]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

Such as?

They can of course choose to do any job they like

They choose to be teachers for example, they dont have to be. If you dont like it, do something else you choose to do. Then realise just how well paid you are as a teacher, and how good your T&C's are

I really cant even begin to comprehend where the "we deserve x" mentality comes from. You would be laughed out of a private sector job

(i dont know if you are a teacher - interchange it with anything relevant - i tried to stay away from the 13 weeks holiday cheap shot)

[ACE2M]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

In what sense small salaries?
In what sense shit jobs?
In what sense poor pensions?

must be nice to have a £4k pension imo

Some of them obviously do have small salaries in shit jobs with poor pensions - but it's really not indicative of the overall picture

my wife runs a team of 8 in the NHS, who organise help and respond to mostly OAP and mental helth patients in crisis. They deal with truly awful stuff on a daily basis. She earns 25k and will be due a 5k pa pension.

i work with people who earn double that and dont deserve half what she earns. She does it because she believes in the good of it. She could go private anytime and earn 2 or 3x that straight away.

[Solaris]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

In what sense small salaries?
In what sense shit jobs?
In what sense poor pensions?

must be nice to have a £4k pension imo

Some of them obviously do have small salaries in shit jobs with poor pensions - but it's really not indicative of the overall picture

my wife runs a team of 8 in the NHS, who organise help and respond to mostly OAP and mental helth patients in crisis. They deal with truly awful stuff on a daily basis. She earns 25k and will be due a 5k pa pension.

i work with people who earn double that and dont deserve half what she earns. She does it because she believes in the good of it. She could go private anytime and earn 2 or 3x that straight away.

25k is a hell of a lot more than the vast majority of people are on. You realise that?

"i work with people who earn double that and dont deserve half what she earns" is simply your opinion and means nothing. If it was really the case that they weren't worth the money they were being paid, they wouldn't be.

All credit to your missus for doing the job she is, but she's chosen to, she hasn't been forced to do it.

[Jon MW]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

In what sense small salaries?
In what sense shit jobs?
In what sense poor pensions?

must be nice to have a £4k pension imo

Some of them obviously do have small salaries in shit jobs with poor pensions - but it's really not indicative of the overall picture

my wife runs a team of 8 in the NHS, who organise help and respond to mostly OAP and mental helth patients in crisis. They deal with truly awful stuff on a daily basis. She earns 25k and will be due a 5k pa pension.

i work with people who earn double that and dont deserve half what she earns. She does it because she believes in the good of it. She could go private anytime and earn 2 or 3x that straight away.

So that's a sample size of 1 with an obvious personal bias - not that convincing is it?

It's also not a shit job, shit pension or shit salary

A better example would be the part time cleaners or dustmen and road sweepers - they're not particularly nice jobs; but a small sample at the bottom of the scale still wouldn't represent the whole picture

[outragous76]

Ace2M

I genuinely mean what I am about to say and I really hope it doesn't cause offence

Caring people (such as your wife), get something out of being caring, its part of who they are. I find it amazing as I know it is something i could never do.

HOWEVER, they have to accept that it is a benefit in kind of the job. Just like I couldn't do it - therefore I wouldn't want the job, I imagine that your wife wouldn't want to work on a building site (just like the completion of a new build is a pleasure of my job).

So I'm sorry - i dont buy the "i have to wipe shit" or "i have to teach rotten kids" arguments. Every job has its downsides (i have to crawl in horrible dark dank basement through spiders webs, something I truly despise), but I accept it as the down side to my job.

Only when I talk about my job, I dont speak of these things, and never sell the negative to get sympathy (or a better pension etc). I'm sorry to say its a boring old tune that people on our side of the fence cant stand - because all jobs have downsides. My wife has just had to make 12 people redundant, its horrible, but as a manager she accepts it.

[AndrewT]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

[ACE2M]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

if you want to do shit in education and aspire to nothing and not work hard thats their business. They desrve fuck all and i'm still happy that i pay shed loads of tax and  it provides for them in their old age.

people forget the fantastic concept of society we have in this country.

[Jon MW]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

if you want to do shit in education and aspire to nothing and not work hard thats their business. They desrve fuck all.

So the one's in the private sector are all lazy and stupid - but the same one's in the public sector are part of the downtrodden masses?

[mulhuzz]

So the one's in the private sector are all lazy and stupid - but the same one's in the public sector are part of the downtrodden masses?

absolute worldy.

[Bongo]

I agree with you there Guy. If her job is awful and she could get 2-3 times the salary elsewhere then why doesn't she do that?

[ACE2M]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

if you want to do shit in education and aspire to nothing and not work hard thats their business. They desrve fuck all.

So the one's in the private sector are all lazy and stupid - but the same one's in the public sector are part of the downtrodden masses?

not what i said.

I work in the private sector and work my bollocks off, i see people in the so called lesser jobs who aren't dumb but they are are happy to coast. I want to go snowboarding twice a year and be able to buy the stuff i want etc, i work hard for it.

I also see people come into to those lesser jobs who aren't particularly amazing at anything but they work their nuts off and get somewhere.

[ACE2M]

I agree with you there Guy. If her job is awful and she could get 2-3 times the salary elsewhere then why doesn't she do that?

Because not everyone is driven to earn money purely for the sake of it.

They will drive out all the good staff who have the option to earn more and cost themselves more in the long run due to having to promote people less able to those postions.

[Jon MW]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

if you want to do shit in education and aspire to nothing and not work hard thats their business. They desrve fuck all.

So the one's in the private sector are all lazy and stupid - but the same one's in the public sector are part of the downtrodden masses?

not what i said.

...

My impression was that AndrewT was talking about people doing the same job in the private sector compared to in the public sector

In the public sector they have a shit job, shit wage and poor pension
in the private sector they have a shit job, worse wage and no pension

The private sector was either never as good as the public sector - or it's been downgraded during the recession to already make it worse; the cuts aren't good - but they're only the public sector catching up with what everybody else has already had to suffer. That's why there's little sympathy.

[outragous76]

I agree with you there Guy. If her job is awful and she could get 2-3 times the salary elsewhere then why doesn't she do that?

Because not everyone is driven to earn money purely for the sake of it.

They will drive out all the good staff who have the option to earn more and cost themselves more in the long run due to having to promote people less able to those postions.

And this is the esscence of my point!

They dont thou do they! You think these individuals dont know they have choices? There are plenty lifers in all of these places, because they know it isnt that bad

and if they arent in it for the money then their pension change of a few % wont bother them

[Solaris]

i'm surprised there is no sympathy whatsoever for people who earn small salaries, do shit jobs that you wouldn't do and receive relatively poor pensions who are being told to take an effective 5% pay cut, pay another 5% more into their pensions, work for longer and receive less than they were promised.

it would appear you all lap up the tory spin on everything. The median national health service pension is £4000 pa.

bring on the flaming......

There are plenty of people in the private sector doing shit jobs for shit money with no pension.

if you want to do shit in education and aspire to nothing and not work hard thats their business. They desrve fuck all.

So the one's in the private sector are all lazy and stupid - but the same one's in the public sector are part of the downtrodden masses?

not what i said.

...

My impression was that AndrewT was talking about people doing the same job in the private sector compared to in the public sector

In the public sector they have a shit job, shit wage and poor pension
in the private sector they have a shit job, worse wage and no pension

The private sector was either never as good as the public sector - or it's been downgraded during the recession to already make it worse; the cuts aren't good - but they're only the public sector catching up with what everybody else has already had to suffer. That's why there's little sympathy.

Spot on.

I work at a company in which there has been a 3 year pay freeze and due to the fantastic concept of 'pay normalization' they will be unlikely to receive a pay rise for a few more years. These guys work their bollocks off for crap pay and ultimately very little reward at the end of it.

People in the public sector need to switch their brains into gear and realise we are ALL suffering.