Thatcher dead?

[bobAlike]

"A man who, beyond the age of 26, finds himself on a bus can count himself as a failure."

Think that's pretty accurate. Last time I got on a bus it stank of piss and somebody was masturbating on the back seat. Sure felt like I was rolling with millionaires.

Whatever floats your boat mate.

[luther101]

Whilst Thatcher didn't cause the Falklands War, it was immensely lucky for her that it happened.

In late 81/early 82 the Tories were under 30% in the polls, suffering at the hands of the SDP/Liberals, an alliance that would never have formed a government with them in the event of a hung parliament.

A few months later, the Tories are at 45% and steaming towards the 1983 landslide.

Without the Falklands, Thatcher becomes our Jimmy Carter.

The timing of the Falklands war was incredible      ....     the landing craft that got the troops ashore were due to have been scrapped 18 months after it commenced.

On the previous occasion that the Argentinians had 'sabre rattled' over the Malvinas, Dr David Owen (with his pre-SDLP Labour hat on) had dispatched one destroyer, and 'leaked' that there was a (non-existent) hunter-killler nuclear sub roaming the S Atlantic, to keep the agressors at bay.

It ought to be remembered that the Argies had assumed that British interests in the area had rescinded when the Tories withdrawn the only British naval presence in the area - the Antarctic survey ship - because (usual Conservative short-termism) of cost!

Thatcher had no interest whatsoever in the Armed Forces before The Falklands    ....     then ended up as some sort of faux-Britannia!

It should also be remembered her government had the lowest post war poll ratings of any ruling party before Galtieri decided to invade.

[TightEnd]

Ryan Giggs made his Man U debut 4 months after Thatcher was booted out by her cabinet.

[nirvana]

You not a fan then Luther?

Course not, he's soooo working class it hurts

Hush Duracell     .....      or I'll tell the nice NHS nurseys @ Harefield hospital about your Neo-NaziConservative views,

I've been told, thanks Loafer, I'm back on the straight and narrow now

[Jon MW]

...
 the landing craft that got the troops ashore were due to have been scrapped 18 months after it commenced.
....
It ought to be remembered that the Argies had assumed that British interests in the area had rescinded when the Tories withdrawn the only British naval presence in the area - the Antarctic survey ship - because (usual Conservative short-termism) of cost!

...

if you look at the history of the armed forces you see that it has nothing to do with any party or government.

It can basically be summed up by:

1. war = army fighting heroically on a shoestring while panic driven spending works it way through the system
2. followed by peace = let's save money by cutting the armed forces
3. Goto 1.

I've read a few books but that's pretty much a few centuries of the British armed forces in a nutshell.

[kinboshi]

....
It ought to be remembered that the Argies had assumed that British interests in the area had rescinded when the Tories withdrawn the only British naval presence in the area - the Antarctic survey ship - because (usual Conservative short-termism) of cost!

...

if you look at the history of the armed forces you see that it has nothing to do with any party or government.

It can basically be summed up by:

1. war = army fighting heroically on a shoestring while panic driven spending works it way through the system
2. followed by peace = let's save money by cutting the armed forces
3. Goto 1.

I've read a few books but that's pretty much a few centuries of the British armed forces in a nutshell.

Doesn't include the arms-dealing though.

[Jon MW]

....
It ought to be remembered that the Argies had assumed that British interests in the area had rescinded when the Tories withdrawn the only British naval presence in the area - the Antarctic survey ship - because (usual Conservative short-termism) of cost!

...

if you look at the history of the armed forces you see that it has nothing to do with any party or government.

It can basically be summed up by:

1. war = army fighting heroically on a shoestring while panic driven spending works it way through the system
2. followed by peace = let's save money by cutting the armed forces
3. Goto 1.

I've read a few books but that's pretty much a few centuries of the British armed forces in a nutshell.

Doesn't include the arms-dealing though.

you could include sub routines for that but that might be involving a bit more of the nut rather than just the shell

[luther101]

Errrmmm - even now coal is used to generate 35/40% of the UK's electricity needs     ....    much of it imported.

I remember Scargill appearing on Question Time after the Miners Strike challenging some triple chinned Tory Minister to give British Coal the same annual subsidy as was given the Nuclear Mob.

Apparently the 'uncompetitive coal industry' could then have supplied the UK's power stations with coal that 'cost' nothing!

 

imported at a far cheaper cost than UK industry could ever produce it......

Nuclear is subsidised because it is cleaner....

Nuclear has a very low risk for a very high benefit. Cradle to grave, nuclear power plants produce very little environmental impact for a very large amount of reliable power produced.

Gulp     ....     the 'grave' of a nuclear power station will still be with us in 25,000 years.

And the bloody cost of de-commissioning has been dumped fairly and squarely at the taxpayers door!

and so your plan for the coal industry in 1981 was?

What would the Cassiobury John Maynard Keynes have done?

I would have invited the Nuclear Industry to have competed on the same terms as the Coal industry - no subsidy!

And when it was clear neither could operate without taxpayers help - I'd have subsidized both.

The Tory solution was to import SUBSIDIZED coal from Germany     ....     funny old mob the Germans - quite good at running a balanced economy.

Also as most British mines closed the shafts were sealed/destroyed to prevent any further use - as energy costs rocketed in future years some of the sabotaged mines could have actually become profitable if they'd been mothballed (the sinking of the shaft being the crucial cost in mining) - other 'unprofitable pits' (like Tower Colliery) actually sold to the miners continued to produce coal for decades after    ....     so how 'unprofitable' were our pits really?

Or was it all bullshit in Thatcher's Revenge on the Miner's Union for making Edward Heath look a prat?

[Jon MW]

About 1% of our coal is imported from the EU, a lot of that might be from Germany where they continue to bend EU rules on state subsidies - but I'd rather have their cheap coal and not have their polluted atmosphere than doing it ourselves.

Like Tighty said fossil fuels are the least preferred option because of their CO2 impact, if we could do it as cheap as Australia or Colombia we'd probably get over it - but as we can't, and as renewables won't produce enough we're left with as much power as nuclear can produce with the left over being run on imports which aren't just cheaper - but massively cheaper - than if we did it ourselves.

[AndrewT]

....
It ought to be remembered that the Argies had assumed that British interests in the area had rescinded when the Tories withdrawn the only British naval presence in the area - the Antarctic survey ship - because (usual Conservative short-termism) of cost!

...

if you look at the history of the armed forces you see that it has nothing to do with any party or government.

It can basically be summed up by:

1. war = army fighting heroically on a shoestring while panic driven spending works it way through the system
2. followed by peace = let's save money by cutting the armed forces
3. Goto 1.

I've read a few books but that's pretty much a few centuries of the British armed forces in a nutshell.

Doesn't include the arms-dealing though.

Hey leave Mark out of this - his mum's just died.

[Sark79]

All I have heard all day is negative comments about her death while at work. Like her or not, she is still a big part of British history and should be respected. RIP

[Mohican]

This summed it up for me, sorry if it was posted earlier in the thread-  As Boris Starling has written: "If you hated Margaret Thatcher, the time to celebrate/crow/insult was when she lost her political power, not her life"

[tonytats]

Other great politicians of the 80s
Michael foot Maybe a great thinker but hardly a charismatic leader
Neil kin nock useless windbag
John major anybody who admits to shagging Edwina currie must need their head lookin at and their judgement questioning ?

All of them men yet none of had something thatcher did ?? Balls great big balls and backbone pity there's no more like her

[tonytats]

"A man who, beyond the age of 26, finds himself on a bus can count himself as a failure."

Think that's pretty accurate. Last time I got on a bus it stank of piss and somebody was masturbating on the back seat. Sure felt like I was rolling with millionaires.

Hope u didn't recognise me ?

[Tal]

Ryan Giggs made his Man U debut 4 months after Thatcher was booted out by her cabinet.

Another blooming conspiracy theorist...