Since playing these £15-£50 comps around the Genting Card Rooms posting antes in a 20 min clock comp just seemed unnecessary and time consuming to me, I asked players on my tables, and they agreed that 'its a right pain'.
I asked Toby Stone (TD of the EPT and UKIPT) and our very own Simon Trumper (TD of a crappy industrial unit in Nottingham) -"why don't we remove antes from 1 day (or 1 evening) comps, as there comps are all effectively turbos no matter what fancy name we give them."
Both are in agreement that antes are not necessary in these format of comps - they are there for 'purist' reasons, in reality, the quicker clock and levels missing already eat away quickly into players stacks and therefore force players to make action.
I am personally 100% behind taking antes out of all DTD's £15 to £50 evening and 1 day comps for the following reasons;
1. These DTD comps are mainly aimed at recreational players, £15-£50 buy-ins, we need the game as simple as possible at this level
2. Players will see more hands per round with no antes because of the time saved to collect/count and payout the antes, more hands has got to mean a better live experience
3. Antes are introduced to 'force action', which I understand in Deepstack 2-4 day comps with longer clocks and small steps in blind levels, but 1 day comps are 15-30 mins with loads of levels missing, 'action' is already being forced in this comps so putting extra pressure on players with antes worsens the experience especially for the beginner/novice
4. Antes don't effect the time the comp will finish, this is determined by the SB BB structure, if fact, eliminating antes will increase hands dealt so might speed up the comp in certain areas.
As always, your feedback is much appreciated
Cheers Rob
Hi Rob, i am defintely behind the decision of keeping antes in. In these liveaments you have been playing would you say the starting stacks are too deep for the nightly cardroom turbo comp?
It's clear all these comps are turbos and have to be to get finished in reasonable time, circa 7hrs. your point of making it simple as possible for the players doesn't make much of a point, ante's are a very simple and easily understandable part of all tournament structures.
I'm sure that the increase in hands per hour in these comps will not change game flow, it could be up to 5 hands per hour more but that is rather irrelevant. Antes are introduced to force action, and this is needed. Your average rec doesnt play much poker on the felt, they play 'snap' with flops and wait for big starting hands, you know aswell as i do, rec players care less about structure and more about starting stacks. this is why we are getting infated 30k+ starting stacks in certain places. this is definitely not good for the poker economy as newer players are getting less chance to learn how to effectively ''play'' the game, bluff/float ect and play the game for what it is! the stacks are so deep they think more about preservation and opportunitys to wait for their next big hand. than technicals of the game, years ago when starting stacks were 30bb players had great fun and punted stacks like no tomorrow, there was clear;y a sense of excitement and fear of knowing you gotta get going from the start. now players are just folding heros.
I do struggle to put my point across as well as i think of it.
What i am concluding is, after the honeymoon period of taking antes out, i am 100% sure your tournaments will last longer and longer and become more of a fold festival. speeding up the deal will give people incentives to carry on folding as the next hand will take less time to be given to them.
If i could have my way, no cardroom nightly turbo would have a starting stack of more than 8000 chips @50/100 as that will get people busting out earlier, therefore creating a deeper game later on.
as it was said. the grand prix final had 10bb avg. this is because these kind of players take no consideration into stack sizes in correlation to blind levels. but to pay bubbles/jumps and getting to final table.