FOBT's

[action man]

the problem i have with FOBTs is the people who are predisposed to them, purely by being in a bookies. Maybe having a bet on the national or a tip. They then have a £5er in and its utterly addictive. At least people who go to a casino actually know what they are getting when they get there.

[arbboy]

agree with trigg on this.  I know people in shops close to me who are £5 or £10 punters race by race.  Have been for years and years.  Lose every year. blah blah blah but its their hobby/social life etc.  Several of these haven't had £100 bet in their life in 20/30/40 years of punting over the counter yet several have just turned into FOBT junkies in the last few years.  It's a totally diff beast that punting on the high st has never seen.

[AdamM]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

[DungBeetle]

Saying "seek help" to these people seems a cop out by the industry to me.

The fact is the poor addicted guy can do himself far more damage standing at his FOBT as opposed to having £10 on each race on the card in the bookies.

[arbboy]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

In that example banning Whiksy will stop Whiskey only drinkers from drinking therefore it will reduce alcohol problems in the population.  It won't solve all the problems but it will help.  Banning FOBT's will reduce problem gambling within the poorest and most vunerable sectors of society.  That's fact.  For many of these people they don't have access to bank accounts/internet access and deal in cash.  Therefore to fund their roulette habit they will have to find a casino, stroll up to it suitably attired, join and give ID in order to enter (which many illegally in this country with no bank account who operate in cash only) won't be able to provide.  It will not stop every roulette punter from switching from FOBT's to casino gambling but believe me it will have a major impact.  

[tikay]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

Hi Adam,

Well yes, you should know that I'm only too aware of that, believe me! It's a major focus for Online Gaming sites at present.

For clarity in the debate, both Adam & I have a conflict of interest here, as we both have business connections related to Online Slots.

I have not debated for or against, I just think that focussing on FOBT's in LBO's is a bit of a narrow base for discussion.

[tikay]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

In that example banning Whiksy will stop Whiskey only drinkers from drinking therefore it will reduce alcohol problems in the population.  It won't solve all the problems but it will help.  Banning FOBT's will reduce problem gambling within the poorest and most vunerable sectors of society.  That's fact.  For many of these people they don't have access to bank accounts/internet access and deal in cash.  Therefore to fund their roulette habit they will have to find a casino, stroll up to it suitably attired, join and give ID in order to enter (which many illegally in this country with no bank account who operate in cash only) won't be able to provide.  It will not stop every roulette punter from switching from FOBT's to casino gambling but believe me it will have a major impact.  

Is that still true?

I can walk into many UK casinos without being a Member, having ID on me, reporting to Reception, or signing in.

Rendezvous Brighton, Aspers Stratford, Aspers Newcastle, to name but three. 

[arbboy]

It's true in those cases but the vast majority of casinos in the uk don't operate that policy which i personally think is a good thing.

[mondatoo]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

In that example banning Whiksy will stop Whiskey only drinkers from drinking therefore it will reduce alcohol problems in the population.  It won't solve all the problems but it will help.  Banning FOBT's will reduce problem gambling within the poorest and most vunerable sectors of society.  That's fact.  For many of these people they don't have access to bank accounts/internet access and deal in cash.  Therefore to fund their roulette habit they will have to find a casino, stroll up to it suitably attired, join and give ID in order to enter (which many illegally in this country with no bank account who operate in cash only) won't be able to provide.  It will not stop every roulette punter from switching from FOBT's to casino gambling but believe me it will have a major impact.  

Is that still true?

I can walk into many UK casinos without being a Member, having ID on me, reporting to Reception, or signing in.

Rendezvous Brighton, Aspers Stratford, Aspers Newcastle, to name but three. 

Think it's only the case at Aspers Newcastle when it's really busy, so basically just during poker festivals, lolz I know.

[Cf]

Hippodrome let you in without membership too. Don't think it should be allowed.

[tikay]

Hippodrome let you in without membership too. Don't think it should be allowed.

Correct.

Let's not get too technical, but generally speaking there is not an obligation to "sign in", in most cases it is for admin or data-capture purposes.

[arbboy]

To add balance to this the actual rules in 'walk in' casinos are as follows:  If you attempt to spend or cash out more than £1500 full ID will be required to do so.  I actually think this limit is too high and should be around £500.  The idea of walk in casino's is so casual £20/£50 'saturday night' punters can have a spin up/drink/meal without having all the hassle of signing up etc.  Reducing the limit would also reduce the ability of people to launder money whilst not stopping any of the normal staking 'saturday night' punters from having a total hassle free experience in a casino.

[BorntoBubble]

Also if you look under 30 you will probably get ID'd on the door.

Tikay have you not had this issue before?

[AndrewT]

Was hugely annoying when casinos ditched the compulsory membership - the Empire on Leicester Square was a great spot for a quiet late drink on a Saturday night - when they let walk-ups in it got rammed like everywhere else.

[Omm]

Was hugely annoying when casinos ditched the compulsory membership - the Empire on Leicester Square was a great spot for a quiet late drink on a Saturday night - when they let walk-ups in it got rammed like everywhere else.

I bet the management are happy.