The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

Stronger employment growth partially offsets the wage downgrade - the new forecasts imply an extra 150,000 people in work in 2022

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[TightEnd]

The OBR forecasts suggest the current living standards squeeze will last longer than the post-crisis squeeze, though it will be shallower

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[TightEnd]

Starting point for any view of the Budget is the truly awful productivity forecasts - making this the worst decade for productivity growth since 1812 – when Napoleon was busy invading Russia

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[TightEnd]

Brexit means that UK cities no longer qualify for European Capital of Culture 2023.

Dundee, Leeds and Nottingham had submitted bids.

It's a big thing. Liverpool estimated it generated a return of £750m to the local economy from £170m of spending.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-42097692

[TightEnd]

Brexit explodes the delicate ambiguity that underpins stability in Northern Ireland.

http://www.economist.com/news/europe/21731635-british-voters-forgot-peace-deal-depended-both-sides-being-part-european

[TightEnd]

Britain must accept more immigrants if it wants a free trade deal, warns senior Indian diplomat

which is ironic

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/23/britain-must-accept-immigrants-wants-free-trade-deal-warns-senior/

[TightEnd]

YouGov/Times:

CON 39 (-1)
LAB 41 (-2)
LD 7 (+1)

N=1,644

[TightEnd]

Peston believes that people like him have a duty to make up for their past sins by delivering a Brexit that works for everyone

http://www.economist.com/news/books-and-arts/21731615-robert-peston-has-not-single-family-member-or-friend-who-voted-brexit-he-aims?fsrc=scn/tw/te/bl/ed/amemberoftheliberaleliteonhistribesfailingshairshirttime

[nirvana]

Stronger employment growth partially offsets the wage downgrade - the new forecasts imply an extra 150,000 people in work in 2022

Click to see full-size image.

I recently watched a 1963 documentary about unemployment in West Hartlepool in 1963. I posted it on the TV thread so I expect most of Blonde have watched it now.

Also, my wife works in a role where the aim of the organisation is to help people in to work. This throws up loads of cases where the people, through some kind of issues, physical or mental, are declared fit for work and paid minimal benefits but in reality they are pretty much unemployable by typical organisations. As a result of being declared fit for work the level of benefits they can obtain are very low.

Made me ponder on wage stagnation - for a very large part of the population it isn't really an issue I would lose much sleep over. On balance, would take the view that more or less full employment (and ours is pretty full by most standards) is a much more relevant guage as to how society is doing overall. Beyond this, wage stagnation would be more tolerable if some element of the benefit to employers was taken via tax and used to ensure much fairer distribution of benefits that provided a more acceptable standard of living for people who really shouldn't be expected to live on the amounts they are given.

The Haretlepool documentary has brought out the neo-luddite in me as well - I think I want to smash up all development in driverless cars - other than benefits to employers whose idealised view of a workforce number is zero, is there any benefit to society in the development of these ? - I tried and I really can't think of one

[Woodsey]

True about the driverless cars. However there is a flip side to that, I read a stat recently that said something along the lines of people who are born now, for a reasonable % of them ( can’t remember the exact no) their future jobs don’t even exist yet. So as one opportunity dies off another one is created.

[doubleup]

True about the driverless cars. However there is a flip side to that, I read a stat recently that said something along the lines of people who are born now, for a reasonable % of them ( can’t remember the exact no) their future jobs don’t even exist yet. So as one opportunity dies off another one is created.

I'm fairly sure there weren't any "bus shelter liaison officers" a few years ago.  That doesn't mean that it isn't a totally made up job.

Most genuine "new" jobs are just different ways of doing the same thing.  Sending a text (with all the infrastructure and jobs that involves) is essentially just the same as two men waving flags at each other.  Vast parts of the manufacturing sector are about creating machines that do stuff quicker so that we can do other stuff in the time saved.  Entertainment and games are certainly a source of completely new activities and I suppose medical advances might be as well.  But imo the only way the system is going to keep ticking over with increased automation is with some sort of universal income.  And that means taxation of the companies profiting from automation. 

[TightEnd]

Click to see full-size image.

[MintTrav]

I think I want to smash up all development in driverless cars - other than benefits to employers whose idealised view of a workforce number is zero, is there any benefit to society in the development of these ? - I tried and I really can't think of one

Safety. There has been massive success in reducing the bloodbath on the roads, but it has now flatlined again for the last few years. Further improvement seems difficult with current technology but driverless cars are likely to lead to a dramatic reduction in deaths and injuries.

[nirvana]

I think I want to smash up all development in driverless cars - other than benefits to employers whose idealised view of a workforce number is zero, is there any benefit to society in the development of these ? - I tried and I really can't think of one

Safety. There has been massive success in reducing the bloodbath on the roads, but it has now flatlined again for the last few years. Further improvement seems difficult with current technology but driverless cars are likely to lead to a dramatic reduction in deaths and injuries.

Aah yes, hadn't thought along those lines. I guess traffic management and reducing jams etc would probably promote productivity too. I'm probably too old and fairly stuck on a certain set of views that make it hard for me to embrace some things, even if they have their positives

[EvilPie]

I think I want to smash up all development in driverless cars - other than benefits to employers whose idealised view of a workforce number is zero, is there any benefit to society in the development of these ? - I tried and I really can't think of one

Safety. There has been massive success in reducing the bloodbath on the roads, but it has now flatlined again for the last few years. Further improvement seems difficult with current technology but driverless cars are likely to lead to a dramatic reduction in deaths and injuries.

Aah yes, hadn't thought along those lines. I guess traffic management and reducing jams etc would probably promote productivity too. I'm probably too old and fairly stuck on a certain set of views that make it hard for me to embrace some things, even if they have their positives

I imagine it'll start on a few sections of motorways initially similar to when the trialled 'smart' motorways before rolling more out. Nice easy lines to follow, single direction traffic, brainless driving. I imagine in motorway situations driverless cars would be significantly safer. They keep safe distances and they don't fall asleep would be the biggest benefits particularly during rush hour situations.

In a few years the cars will be talking to each other as well so if there's an incident ahead your car will be warned in advance and slow the traffic flow automatically to a steady stop rather than a last second slam on the brakes.

The difficulty is mixing driverless with standard vehicles as they're both working to a different set of rules. Actually they're working to the same rules but standard car drivers can choose to ignore them.