The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[nirvana]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Yah. Never seen that before

[david3103]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

[OverTheBorder]

Douglas is taking it well lol

[doubleup]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

[PokerBroker]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

What is so good about the European Union? 

You seem to have some sort of hardon for bureaucracy, I don't think anyone here has stated their wouldn't be any short term fall out, but for the majority of leave voters on here the long term gains benefit the majority.   

Democracy is king and the fact that democratic will of the people isn't being put at the top of the agenda is why we find ourselves in this position. 

[nirvana]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

I can readily think of loads of negatives but you only ever talk about trade deals which frankly doesnt really get me too angsty

[TightEnd]

Tony Blair faces calls for impeachment on release of Chilcot report http://gu.com/p/4nk7d/stw

[BigAdz]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

I'm in the leave camp and there are plenty of things that worry me.
Contrary to your post,
I have yet to see a remainer say anything vaguely positive about leaving

[rfgqqabc]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

What is so good about the European Union? 

You seem to have some sort of hardon for bureaucracy, I don't think anyone here has stated their wouldn't be any short term fall out, but for the majority of leave voters on here the long term gains benefit the majority.   

Democracy is king and the fact that democratic will of the people isn't being put at the top of the agenda is why we find ourselves in this position. 

They help protect against members of the Eu, having differing legislation that collides. Increased rights for workers/consumers. Freedom of movement, freedom of work.

Honestly what is your newly democratic Britain going to do? The democratic will of the people follows whatever Murdoch puts in the Sun. Probably his suggestion to Cameron in all those weekly meetings. Mythical sovereignty to watch the same vested interests have even more control. I know most leave voters think it was right, hence the way they voted. But just telling me it's going to be good when they actual outcome is unknown seems silly. Regurgitating the tagline about short term pain for long term gain is largely futile when the long could be 2-20 years.

When I google what is the Eu good for then I find a list of reasonable answers, some more persuasive than others, and when I google is it bad I get lists of nonsense and gibberish from loons. If I ask why you think the EU is bad I'm sure I'll be told about over regulation and immigration. People like to say the Eu has too many rules, when I ask them to highlight them they can't. They will simply always complain about the regulator,  whether it be the council, government or European. The examples go from myths to outright lies but ignore such beautiful examples as equine passports needing identification silhouettes. I do not see this as a triumph for democracy due to the nature of the campaigns from both sides and the potential swing of leave voters who said they would change their mind. I think the success of the Leave campaign should really worry anyone interested in British politics because we have just seen the lies and propaganda work.

Britain as an open economy gained a whole lot from negotiating as part of the union where some markets weren't so open. This is a huge economic plus which has been lost by the Leave campaingers. Hopefully we find a way to work something out or the European Union is forced to negotiate from a weak position.

[doubleup]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

I'm in the leave camp and there are plenty of things that worry me.
Contrary to your post,
I have yet to see a remainer say anything vaguely positive about leaving

rofl - why should remainers say something positive?  It's leavers who lied to the country in the campaign, its leavers who are telling immigrants that they are going to be sent home and its leavers who are living in fantasy land about this country's future prospects.  

[PokerBroker]

Tony Blair faces calls for impeachment on release of Chilcot report http://gu.com/p/4nk7d/stw

I sincerely hope Corbyn brings down every last one of them. 

[Cf]

http://thebrexitplan.com/

[PokerBroker]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

I'm in the leave camp and there are plenty of things that worry me.
Contrary to your post,
I have yet to see a remainer say anything vaguely positive about leaving

rofl - why should remainers say something positive?  It's leavers who lied to the country in the campaign, its leavers who are telling immigrants that they are going to be sent home and its leavers who are living in fantasy land about this country's future prospects.  

And the remainers never told any lies?  Not one? 

You can't expect serious debate when all you do is chirp from the sidelines and try and denigrate every argument with comments like rofl.  I bet you're not. 

[PokerBroker]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

What is so good about the European Union? 

You seem to have some sort of hardon for bureaucracy, I don't think anyone here has stated their wouldn't be any short term fall out, but for the majority of leave voters on here the long term gains benefit the majority.   

Democracy is king and the fact that democratic will of the people isn't being put at the top of the agenda is why we find ourselves in this position. 

They help protect against members of the Eu, having differing legislation that collides. Increased rights for workers/consumers. Freedom of movement, freedom of work.

Honestly what is your newly democratic Britain going to do? The democratic will of the people follows whatever Murdoch puts in the Sun. Probably his suggestion to Cameron in all those weekly meetings. Mythical sovereignty to watch the same vested interests have even more control. I know most leave voters think it was right, hence the way they voted. But just telling me it's going to be good when they actual outcome is unknown seems silly. Regurgitating the tagline about short term pain for long term gain is largely futile when the long could be 2-20 years.

When I google what is the Eu good for then I find a list of reasonable answers, some more persuasive than others, and when I google is it bad I get lists of nonsense and gibberish from loons. If I ask why you think the EU is bad I'm sure I'll be told about over regulation and immigration. People like to say the Eu has too many rules, when I ask them to highlight them they can't. They will simply always complain about the regulator,  whether it be the council, government or European. The examples go from myths to outright lies but ignore such beautiful examples as equine passports needing identification silhouettes. I do not see this as a triumph for democracy due to the nature of the campaigns from both sides and the potential swing of leave voters who said they would change their mind. I think the success of the Leave campaign should really worry anyone interested in British politics because we have just seen the lies and propaganda work.

Britain as an open economy gained a whole lot from negotiating as part of the union where some markets weren't so open. This is a huge economic plus which has been lost by the Leave campaingers. Hopefully we find a way to work something out or the European Union is forced to negotiate from a weak position.

Loons of course it's the loons. 

Did you read the article I posted that was penned by the RMT Assistant General Secretary Steve Hedley?

Have you heard of TTIP?
Have you heard of the European Mortgage Credit Directive?
Workers rights?  Really.  They have sure helped the workers in countries of Southern Europe. 

Why not EFTA? Seems the best of both worlds. 

I have no issue with immigration, my issue is when we have beggars from Romania/Albania coming here with no intention of working but instead to operate in criminal gangs that are involved in all manner of bad shit.   Of course those who love in middle class suburbia are probably sheltered by this and don't experience what actually happens on the street. 

If it was a choice between an immigrant coming here to work and a job shy born and bread brit I'd take the migrant every single time. 

[rfgqqabc]

God for jobs tho

completely and utterly non-productive jobs

Probably more productive than being in charge of the monthly commute from Brussels to Strasbourg.

In any event, the 'new' jobs will be created in an area where they are working toward improving our future. Creating our new trading relationship with the world at large.

it just isn't possible for a leaver to admit any aspect of their regressive project is negative, is it?

What is so good about the European Union?  

You seem to have some sort of hardon for bureaucracy, I don't think anyone here has stated their wouldn't be any short term fall out, but for the majority of leave voters on here the long term gains benefit the majority.  

Democracy is king and the fact that democratic will of the people isn't being put at the top of the agenda is why we find ourselves in this position.  

They help protect against members of the Eu, having differing legislation that collides. Increased rights for workers/consumers. Freedom of movement, freedom of work.

Honestly what is your newly democratic Britain going to do? The democratic will of the people follows whatever Murdoch puts in the Sun. Probably his suggestion to Cameron in all those weekly meetings. Mythical sovereignty to watch the same vested interests have even more control. I know most leave voters think it was right, hence the way they voted. But just telling me it's going to be good when they actual outcome is unknown seems silly. Regurgitating the tagline about short term pain for long term gain is largely futile when the long could be 2-20 years.

When I google what is the Eu good for then I find a list of reasonable answers, some more persuasive than others, and when I google is it bad I get lists of nonsense and gibberish from loons. If I ask why you think the EU is bad I'm sure I'll be told about over regulation and immigration. People like to say the Eu has too many rules, when I ask them to highlight them they can't. They will simply always complain about the regulator,  whether it be the council, government or European. The examples go from myths to outright lies but ignore such beautiful examples as equine passports needing identification silhouettes. I do not see this as a triumph for democracy due to the nature of the campaigns from both sides and the potential swing of leave voters who said they would change their mind. I think the success of the Leave campaign should really worry anyone interested in British politics because we have just seen the lies and propaganda work.

Britain as an open economy gained a whole lot from negotiating as part of the union where some markets weren't so open. This is a huge economic plus which has been lost by the Leave campaingers. Hopefully we find a way to work something out or the European Union is forced to negotiate from a weak position.

Loons of course it's the loons.  

Did you read the article I posted that was penned by the RMT Assistant General Secretary Steve Hedley?

Have you heard of TTIP?
Have you heard of the European Mortgage Credit Directive?
Workers rights?  Really.  They have sure helped the workers in countries of Southern Europe.  

Why not EFTA? Seems the best of both worlds.  

I have no issue with immigration, my issue is when we have beggars from Romania/Albania coming here with no intention of working but instead to operate in criminal gangs that are involved in all manner of bad shit.   Of course those who love in middle class suburbia are probably sheltered by this and don't experience what actually happens on the street.  

If it was a choice between an immigrant coming here to work and a job shy born and bread brit I'd take the migrant every single time.  

No, Yes, Yes but briefly/hazy understanding. Debatable ofc, not sure we can blame the EU on mass unemployment in specific countries as much as we would like to. The euro is but I still think individual countries have to take responsibility for their own fiscal policy.

 I don't think EFTA is on the cards, or would be what the democratic power of the people wanted. Norway had to pay a heavy price to get in, one so heavy they regret it.

Having read more about the EMCD thing it does seem particularly terrible. How did it get ratified when it seems so obviously flawed? Thanks for the info, I certainly didn't clock on to the implications on first reading.

edit: I only put loons because I put into google, what is good about the EU and got a bunch of normal pages/lists from campaigners/bloggers. When I changed the good to bad it went into a full text diatribe. I'm also really well protected in my middle class bubble in Hungary lol. I suppose living in Stockton for a few years really makes you part of the prawn sarnie brigade.