The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

Click to see full-size image.

[TightEnd]

 Owen Smith may not beat Jeremy Corbyn, but he passed the Today test

Michael White

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2016/aug/24/owen-smith-may-not-beat-jeremy-corbyn-but-he-passed-the-today-test?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Tweet

[Woodsey]

Are trains in Britain as overcrowded as Jeremy Corbyn claims?

a good summary

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/aug/24/virgin-trains-fares-overcrowding-jeremy-corbyn-railways-q-and-a?CMP=twt_gu

I use the train to go all over the country probably 2-3 times every week, very rare I don't get a seat, and if I don't it will usually be only for a short part of the trip.

[MintTrav]

We have seen the pictures from France of their burqini law being enforced. The first woman isn't even wearing a burqini, but is deemed to be wearing too many clothes. It is unclear whether she was fined, but the women in the other two photos were, and there have been other cases. It seems unbelievable thst the French have reached this stage, first with the burqa ban, and then its extension to burqinis in several towns. Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

Click to see full-size image.

Click to see full-size image.

[doubleup]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

[Doobs]

Are trains in Britain as overcrowded as Jeremy Corbyn claims?

a good summary

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/aug/24/virgin-trains-fares-overcrowding-jeremy-corbyn-railways-q-and-a?CMP=twt_gu

I use the train to go all over the country probably 2-3 times every week, very rare I don't get a seat, and if I don't it will usually be only for a short part of the trip.

I lived in Wandsworth for several years.  There was absolutely zero chance of getting a seat on the train between 7.15 and 9.  Between 7.30 and 8.30, you'd usually have to wait to get on a train.  Either they were already rammed, or so rammed that only a couple of people could squeeze in.  When I say rammed, I mean you had your nose in someone's armpit and not that you couldn't find a set of 4 seats together.  Fwiw there were plans to extend the lemgth of trains when I left, which supposedly was going to make things better.  No idea what it is like now, because hundreds of new flats were also getting built.

I now live outside London near the start of a route, so get a seat every morning (more or less).  Those nearer London are usually standing, but nothing like as bad as Wandsworth used to be.  On the way back I am pretty much always standing if I get on a train that is about to leave London after work.  I frequently just aim to arrive early or just get the next train.  

Either way, a late morning train out of London, just seems a terrible choice to make this point.  Have none of his team had any experience of commuting at rush hour?

I

[RED-DOG]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

This is the terrorists winning. IMHO of course.

[Doobs]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

Don't nuns dress like that any can't imagine there are many men forcing them to do it.

And the picture is of an armed man forcing a woman to take what looks like a hijab(?) off.  Or a backward man telling a woman how to live her life in other's eyes.  

Whilst I worry a bit about whether your average burka is entrely in line with the wearer's free will, I expect most hijab wearers are free enough or happy enough to wear one.  It isn't uncommon to see family gatherings where some wear the hijab and some don't.  Obviously this isn't always the case, but my assumption is that they are more likely to making their own choice than not.

[DaveShoelace]

Doesn't make much sense to me, seems like a 'signalling' attempt to show the country they are actively working to prevent Islamic extremism, because right now everyone in France is very upset at how seemingly ineffective and passive the government has been. Understandably so too, the blood that has been shed in France is horrifying. I don't see how this helps anyone though, it reminds me when that fuckwit Dylan Roof shot up the church in America and the response was to ban the confederate flag.

Isn't it Hijabs and not Burqas that are being banned here? From the images I've seen it's Hijabs. I can kinda understand the logic of banning Burqas, at least in high security areas like airports, because it covers everything and there have been terrorist attacks before where men have dressed up as women in Burqas to bypass security. I can't see how a Hijab causes any security concerns in that respect because you can see the person's face.

There is undeniably a problem with women being forced to wear hijabs/burqas, one which a lot of people ignore. But it is also undeniable that many choose to wear it, as Doobs says in the same way Nuns do. There is a problem that needs to be tackled there but I don't think it's an armed guard on the beach problem.

[MintTrav]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

I read your comment several times and was confused as the two sentences seemed to contradict each other. But I've just realised that you didn't mean the police when you referred to men telling women how to live their lives.

[doubleup]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

I read your comment several times and was confused as the two sentences seemed to contradict each other. But I've just realised that you didn't mean the police when you referred to men telling women how to live their lives.

You know what I mean.

and here is another example

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/ultra-orthodox-rabbis-ban-women-from-going-to-university-in-case-they-get-dangerous-secular-a7204171.html

Fundamental Christians/Catholics with their attitude to abortion and birth control also fail in this regard.

[The Camel]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

I read your comment several times and was confused as the two sentences seemed to contradict each other. But I've just realised that you didn't mean the police when you referred to men telling women how to live their lives.

You know what I mean.

and here is another example

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/ultra-orthodox-rabbis-ban-women-from-going-to-university-in-case-they-get-dangerous-secular-a7204171.html

Fundamental Christians/Catholics with their attitude to abortion and birth control also fail in this regard.

News flash.

Religion sucks.

[MintTrav]

Let's hope this madness doesn't come here.

It isn't madness.  We need more laws to stop backward men telling women how to live their lives.

I read your comment several times and was confused as the two sentences seemed to contradict each other. But I've just realised that you didn't mean the police when you referred to men telling women how to live their lives.

You know what I mean.

and here is another example

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/ultra-orthodox-rabbis-ban-women-from-going-to-university-in-case-they-get-dangerous-secular-a7204171.html

Fundamental Christians/Catholics with their attitude to abortion and birth control also fail in this regard.

I honestly didn't - but I accept I was misreading your post.

Doobs and DaveShoelace make good points. We all agree with you that men shouldn't be allowed to tell women what to do, what to wear, etc. It those are your views, it seems strange that you are against allowing women to wear hijabs, burqinis, etc if they want to.

Interesting that the page you have linked to includes a link to an article about Scottish police now allowing hijabs to be worn as part of the uniform (which I have seen in other countries, with no apparent problems).

[doubleup]

The entire burka/niqab issue is inextricably linked with attitudes to women - eg a women dressing in a certain way deserves to be raped. 

The best way to deal with such behaviour is to ban it.  The police are enforcing the ban - presumably you would be ok if it was female police?

[MintTrav]

The entire burka/niqab issue is inextricably linked with attitudes to women - eg a women dressing in a certain way deserves to be raped. 

The best way to deal with such behaviour is to ban it.  The police are enforcing the ban - presumably you would be ok if it was female police?

Sorry, confused again. Not sure if you are serious. Obviously, it would be the same if they were female, but it's not really about the police - they don't make the laws. You clearly don't accept that most women who wear these items in Western countries do so by choice. I do, based on having heard many of them say so. I was working in an office last month where one woman was really angry because someone had questioned her wearing the scarf (as she called it) when she hadn't done so before, as she said it is her choice what she wears. You object to people imposing these clothes but, by wanting to ban them, you are no different.