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Poll
Question: How will you vote on December 12th 2019
Conservative - 19 (33.9%)
Labour - 12 (21.4%)
SNP - 2 (3.6%)
Lib Dem - 8 (14.3%)
Brexit - 1 (1.8%)
Green - 6 (10.7%)
Other - 2 (3.6%)
Spoil - 0 (0%)
Not voting - 6 (10.7%)
Total Voters: 55

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Author Topic: The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged  (Read 2180550 times)
TightEnd
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« Reply #22350 on: December 06, 2019, 10:50:07 AM »

HMT leak

Treasury analysis also damning on constitutional impact of Boris Johnson brexit deal

* “Economic union undermined”
* Separates NI “in practice from whole swathes of the UK’s internal market”
* “Precedent set for different treatment for a constituent prt of the UK”
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« Reply #22351 on: December 06, 2019, 10:50:19 AM »

Andrew Neil has challenged Boris Johnson to commit to an interview to face questions on why people have “deemed him to be untrustworthy”

The 3 minute video empty chairing him and calling him out in case anyone missed it

https://twitter.com/PA/status/1202702175367041030?s=20

So the powers in Tory H Q, make the tactical decision it's better to take the flak of a "no show", rather than being grilled by Neil. Can't see it myself, its a mistake.

Surely it wont happen at the next election. Formats/interviews will be formally agreed pre election.
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« Reply #22352 on: December 06, 2019, 10:51:07 AM »

cliffs

Johnson has always been lying about checks, and has always been contradicted by publicly available information. in that sense the leak isn't anything new. but he's been getting away with it, and Labour have learned that people actually pay attention if you say something is a leak
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« Reply #22353 on: December 06, 2019, 10:53:53 AM »

Andrew Neil has challenged Boris Johnson to commit to an interview to face questions on why people have “deemed him to be untrustworthy”

The 3 minute video empty chairing him and calling him out in case anyone missed it

https://twitter.com/PA/status/1202702175367041030?s=20

So the powers in Tory H Q, make the tactical decision it's better to take the flak of a "no show", rather than being grilled by Neil. Can't see it myself, its a mistake.

Surely it wont happen at the next election. Formats/interviews will be formally agreed pre election.

understand it from Tory point of view

on course for a majority, know their man could be exposed, why take the risk?

May make no difference (people who would vote for him may not care, people who do care won't vote for him)

rankles a bit to see him "grilled" on his favourite way to make tea by Holly and Phil yesterday morning  rather than face sensible scrutiny though
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« Reply #22354 on: December 06, 2019, 10:58:56 AM »

Andrew Neil has challenged Boris Johnson to commit to an interview to face questions on why people have “deemed him to be untrustworthy”

The 3 minute video empty chairing him and calling him out in case anyone missed it

https://twitter.com/PA/status/1202702175367041030?s=20

So the powers in Tory H Q, make the tactical decision it's better to take the flak of a "no show", rather than being grilled by Neil. Can't see it myself, its a mistake.

Surely it wont happen at the next election. Formats/interviews will be formally agreed pre election.

understand it from Tory point of view

on course for a majority, know their man could be exposed, why take the risk?

May make no difference (people who would vote for him may not care, people who do care won't vote for him)

rankles a bit to see him "grilled" on his favourite way to make tea by Holly and Phil yesterday morning  rather than face sensible scrutiny though

Goes the other way too....Boris has done an hour phone in with public questions with Nick Ferrari LBC....which Corbyn wont do.
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« Reply #22355 on: December 06, 2019, 11:01:52 AM »

Neil's show gets 6.5m viewers

Ferrari is a backwater by comparison, hardly hits public consciousness (though e did see the clips of Boris gesturing him to move on after 60 seconds on social care!)
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« Reply #22356 on: December 06, 2019, 11:03:47 AM »

Breaking:

former Tory prime minister is refusing to back the Tories:

"Sir John Major will today urge voters to back rebel candidates running against Boris Johnson’s Conservatives in next week's general election."


its all over in a week.
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« Reply #22357 on: December 06, 2019, 11:10:43 AM »

I have to vote to ensure Jezza doesn't become PM and to ensure Brexit gets done. So, with regret, I have to vote Tory. Come on you blues. Hopefully next time there's a palatable Labour option
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« Reply #22358 on: December 06, 2019, 11:20:13 AM »

I have to vote to ensure Jezza doesn't become PM and to ensure Brexit gets done. So, with regret, I have to vote Tory. Come on you blues. Hopefully next time there's a palatable Labour option

I have to vote to ensure that Boris doesn't become PM and to ensure that Brexit might not get done before we come to our senses.
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« Reply #22359 on: December 06, 2019, 11:47:02 AM »

an experiment in pure political tribalism:

how Labour voters react when they think these statements about Jews were said by Boris Johnson instead of Jeremy Corbyn, and are *then* told the truth: 

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=739016943262028

It isn't really an experiment though is it?

An experiment in political tribalism would have equal numbers of Conservative voters been fed Boris Johnson's racist statements and told it is Corbyn.   At the end of the "expirement", we'd find out the proportions of people on each side who were willing to say their leader wasn't fit for office, or the number of each party's supporters who recognised these examples as things their own leader had said, or the proportions that were willing to criticise any racism etc.

It is just another attack on Corbyn from an account that mainly attacks Corbyn. 
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« Reply #22360 on: December 06, 2019, 11:59:26 AM »

I have to vote to ensure Jezza doesn't become PM and to ensure Brexit gets done. So, with regret, I have to vote Tory. Come on you blues. Hopefully next time there's a palatable Labour option


......and that seems to be a constant theme of a lot of voters in the "Red Wall" when you see them being interviewed ie Channel 4, Sky, Newsnight.



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« Reply #22361 on: December 06, 2019, 12:27:32 PM »

an experiment in pure political tribalism:

how Labour voters react when they think these statements about Jews were said by Boris Johnson instead of Jeremy Corbyn, and are *then* told the truth: 

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=739016943262028

It isn't really an experiment though is it?

An experiment in political tribalism would have equal numbers of Conservative voters been fed Boris Johnson's racist statements and told it is Corbyn.   At the end of the "expirement", we'd find out the proportions of people on each side who were willing to say their leader wasn't fit for office, or the number of each party's supporters who recognised these examples as things their own leader had said, or the proportions that were willing to criticise any racism etc.

It is just another attack on Corbyn from an account that mainly attacks Corbyn. 

Clearly the interviewer has a vested interest but it does demonstrate the hypocrisy of Labour voters who have a blinkered view of Jezza.
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« Reply #22362 on: December 06, 2019, 12:48:26 PM »

an experiment in pure political tribalism:

how Labour voters react when they think these statements about Jews were said by Boris Johnson instead of Jeremy Corbyn, and are *then* told the truth: 

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=739016943262028

It isn't really an experiment though is it?

An experiment in political tribalism would have equal numbers of Conservative voters been fed Boris Johnson's racist statements and told it is Corbyn.   At the end of the "expirement", we'd find out the proportions of people on each side who were willing to say their leader wasn't fit for office, or the number of each party's supporters who recognised these examples as things their own leader had said, or the proportions that were willing to criticise any racism etc.

It is just another attack on Corbyn from an account that mainly attacks Corbyn. 

Clearly the interviewer has a vested interest but it does demonstrate the hypocrisy of Labour voters who have a blinkered view of Jezza.


I think it's safe to infer that there are supporters like that on both sides - it would be interesting to see if there was any measure to back up the theory of the Cult of Jezza, or whether there's a similar amount on all sides; but that's not an experiment or poll I think is likely to get commissioned.
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« Reply #22363 on: December 06, 2019, 12:53:01 PM »

I have to vote to ensure Jezza doesn't become PM and to ensure Brexit gets done. So, with regret, I have to vote Tory. Come on you blues. Hopefully next time there's a palatable Labour option


......and that seems to be a constant theme of a lot of voters in the "Red Wall" when you see them being interviewed ie Channel 4, Sky, Newsnight.






Hence it looks like Boris should be buying Jezza a HUGE pot of that Damson Jam for Christmas, because without him as leader........
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« Reply #22364 on: December 06, 2019, 01:06:11 PM »

I was chatting to a work colleague this week, poker player you'd know of, who is canvassing for the Labour party in his spare time in marginals across London and the South.

I told him I couldn't vote for either major party and he told me what he says on the doorstep is "you don't have to like Corbyn to vote for Labour, he won't be around for ever..."

He battles it on the campaign trail every day

I have never voted Labour, but probably would have done this time (against this iteration of the Conservative party) if I had a Cooper or a Benn or a Starmer in charge toning down the barmy/over-optmistic/unedifying stuff and I suppose that might be said of plenty of marginal voters who just can't hold their nose and do it for a Corbyn led party but could for something a little more palatable

As it is, the Brexit vote is a lot more unified than the remain vote 
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