What's the most unpopular benign opinion you hold?

[rinswun]

I don't have a problem with athletes who dope

defo wanna hear more on this!

In my opinion, in a day and age when salary is intrinsically linked to performance, it makes sense for sportsman to push every edge they can get in order to maximise their results. If they are willing to take the consequences that come with getting caught then fair play to them. It's a short career for most and in order to set themselves up for a life post sport, I don't have an issue with those who want to push the boundaries (cheat).

It's admirable for those who don't and still reach the world class level but the guys who are dope by are still doing the same training and still pushing  their bodies to the max. It's basically the ultimate calculated gamble (and we all love gambling!) - risk career, reputation and health but reap the rewards if undetected. There are plenty undetected too.

Young, vulernable kids will be forced into doping by managers, trainers and agents in order for their financial gain.

Who knows what long term risks they will be taking with their health.

Yep. Youngsters' health being put at risk for others personal gain and public entertainment. Basically a sporting reality to contest with physical health replacing mental health.

Youth doping is happening already in a number of sports. I know anecdotally of a few youth rugby players on doping programs in order to get themselves a physique to compete for a first team spot from age 18. 'Natural' youngsters being left behind and not getting contracts. Cycling, basketball, tennis also have youth doping issues.

Is cheating in all forms, in all sports OK for financial gain? Or just drug cheating?

Actively encouraged for me. Aside from golf, obv.

[scotty77]

Was thinking of this when watching the community shield yesterday and saw that Chelsea now have a sponsor on the shoulder.  I watch probably 3/4 matches a week

The effectiveness of advertising is vastly overstated and doesn't factor in much to peoples purchasing decisions.  Out of the 20 headline sponsors I have only used 2, Bet365 and American Express.  Bet365 for the bonus offers and AmEx cos I get more points than using my Visa.  Wasn't at all tempted to switch to Yokohoma tyres.

[arbboy]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

That's hilarious. Just publish a set of rules and then make it self assessment. It pretty much runs itself until you investigate someone.

Easiest way is to make gamblers register as sole traders. You'd have income and expenses the same as every other sole trader in the country and yes if you made a loss one year you could roll it over for tax purposes. All the paperwork is the responsibility of the gambler and they probably need an accountant to help with the year end return. The cost to HMRC though is negligible compared to the revenue generated.

Sure you can just lie but so can everyone else in every other business. It's the risk of getting caught that makes everyone tell the truth and the same would go for the gamblers.

It'll happen one day so make the most of it while you can.

It won't happen in my lifetime.  Happy to bet it does if you want a wager.  If it didn't happen in the ten year credit crunch era when online gambling boomed i am pretty sure it won't happen in the next 20 years.  imo obviously.

[DaveShoelace]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

That's hilarious. Just publish a set of rules and then make it self assessment. It pretty much runs itself until you investigate someone.

Easiest way is to make gamblers register as sole traders. You'd have income and expenses the same as every other sole trader in the country and yes if you made a loss one year you could roll it over for tax purposes. All the paperwork is the responsibility of the gambler and they probably need an accountant to help with the year end return. The cost to HMRC though is negligible compared to the revenue generated.

Sure you can just lie but so can everyone else in every other business. It's the risk of getting caught that makes everyone tell the truth and the same would go for the gamblers.

It'll happen one day so make the most of it while you can.

It won't happen in my lifetime.  Happy to bet it does if you want a wager.  If it didn't happen in the ten year credit crunch era when online gambling boomed i am pretty sure it won't happen in the next 20 years.  imo obviously.

If Corbyn gets in then e is going to find some creative ways of funding his Utopia, could happen imo.

[arbboy]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

That's hilarious. Just publish a set of rules and then make it self assessment. It pretty much runs itself until you investigate someone.

Easiest way is to make gamblers register as sole traders. You'd have income and expenses the same as every other sole trader in the country and yes if you made a loss one year you could roll it over for tax purposes. All the paperwork is the responsibility of the gambler and they probably need an accountant to help with the year end return. The cost to HMRC though is negligible compared to the revenue generated.

Sure you can just lie but so can everyone else in every other business. It's the risk of getting caught that makes everyone tell the truth and the same would go for the gamblers.

It'll happen one day so make the most of it while you can.

It won't happen in my lifetime.  Happy to bet it does if you want a wager.  If it didn't happen in the ten year credit crunch era when online gambling boomed i am pretty sure it won't happen in the next 20 years.  imo obviously.

If Corbyn gets in then e is going to find some creative ways of funding his Utopia, could happen imo.

big if.  he has had his chance and missed by a mile even though most lefites thought he won.  it wouldn't generate a copper coin anyway.  I think it would be tax negative if you combine the cost of collecting it which would be impossible with the lost of legit revenue as the live/online games die for poker and the firms take less action and don't have the pro money to hedge against their mug positions which they need to smooth their earnings time to time.

[DaveShoelace]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

That's hilarious. Just publish a set of rules and then make it self assessment. It pretty much runs itself until you investigate someone.

Easiest way is to make gamblers register as sole traders. You'd have income and expenses the same as every other sole trader in the country and yes if you made a loss one year you could roll it over for tax purposes. All the paperwork is the responsibility of the gambler and they probably need an accountant to help with the year end return. The cost to HMRC though is negligible compared to the revenue generated.

Sure you can just lie but so can everyone else in every other business. It's the risk of getting caught that makes everyone tell the truth and the same would go for the gamblers.

It'll happen one day so make the most of it while you can.

It won't happen in my lifetime.  Happy to bet it does if you want a wager.  If it didn't happen in the ten year credit crunch era when online gambling boomed i am pretty sure it won't happen in the next 20 years.  imo obviously.

If Corbyn gets in then e is going to find some creative ways of funding his Utopia, could happen imo.

big if.  he has had his chance and missed by a mile even though most lefites thought he won.  it wouldn't generate a copper coin anyway.  I think it would be tax negative if you combine the cost of collecting it which would be impossible with the lost of legit revenue as the live/online games die for poker and the firms take less action and don't have the pro money to hedge against their mug positions which they need to smooth their earnings time to time.

Why do you think it would be so hard to collect, other than because of a reluctance on gamblers to be honest on a tax return?

[arbboy]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

That's hilarious. Just publish a set of rules and then make it self assessment. It pretty much runs itself until you investigate someone.

Easiest way is to make gamblers register as sole traders. You'd have income and expenses the same as every other sole trader in the country and yes if you made a loss one year you could roll it over for tax purposes. All the paperwork is the responsibility of the gambler and they probably need an accountant to help with the year end return. The cost to HMRC though is negligible compared to the revenue generated.

Sure you can just lie but so can everyone else in every other business. It's the risk of getting caught that makes everyone tell the truth and the same would go for the gamblers.

It'll happen one day so make the most of it while you can.

It won't happen in my lifetime.  Happy to bet it does if you want a wager.  If it didn't happen in the ten year credit crunch era when online gambling boomed i am pretty sure it won't happen in the next 20 years.  imo obviously.

If Corbyn gets in then e is going to find some creative ways of funding his Utopia, could happen imo.

big if.  he has had his chance and missed by a mile even though most lefites thought he won.  it wouldn't generate a copper coin anyway.  I think it would be tax negative if you combine the cost of collecting it which would be impossible with the lost of legit revenue as the live/online games die for poker and the firms take less action and don't have the pro money to hedge against their mug positions which they need to smooth their earnings time to time.

Why do you think it would be so hard to collect, other than because of a reluctance on gamblers to be honest on a tax return?

[arbboy]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

[DaveShoelace]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

[arbboy]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

The tax man would compare your window cleaner to other window cleaners on similar estates.  How does he compare sam trickett to me?  One of the only advantages of being a pro gambler is paying no tax.  There are bundles of huge disadvantages believe me.  This is why the governement will never rock the boat.  It will never generate enough tax to justify doing it even if they could collect 100% of what they were due.  They get it already from the rake box and the firms from losers anyway.  That is their view of the situation and it will never change.  If it was going to change it would have done between 2000-2015 during the boom years.  There has never been as many pro gamblers from 2015 onwards than ever before and they still have zero desire to tax them.  Nothing will change.

[EvilPie]

British professional gamblers should pay income tax.

I agree in principal but the enforcement and paperwork associated with this would be a nightmare and would probably cost way more than it generates.  Kind of like how the state pension/free TV license isn't means tested so just given to everyone even if they are multi-millionaires.

Also the amount of professional gamblers is actually quite small, how many in total in the UK?  A few thousand?  The govt still rakes 50% of income in live casinos don't they, and 15% of online profits?  Most pro gamblers will have paid more in tax than the avg person via this route, plus the makeup demographics of them will mean that they don't use as many public services as the avg person too (male, between 20 and 40 and without kids).

The average pro gambler def lives in a bubble and they should donate to charity or volunteer tho as its a very selfish industry and perspective is required.

The govt take from casinos and online is actually money from all the losing gamblers. Those that win are not being taxed in any way.

I think it should be a matter of conscience. Those (e.g. Channing, nice bloke that he is) that make chunks from gambling whilst constantly tweeting about how everyone should vote for a socialist agenda that will cost taxpayers a fortune, should be self-declaring their income in order to pay tax & make a fair contribution to all those costly policies they're supporting. I'd hate to think that they're expecting the rest of us to pay for their largesse.

No doubt NC pays tax on his other businesses (e.g. BE), but I would suspect that that only represents a small part of his total income. Also, if such a high profile figure as him volunteered to pay tax, then perhaps there would be others with consciences who would follow. Maybe even some Tory-voting-fascist-fatcats who want to appear a little more caring?

Anyone volunteering to pay tax that they don't legally have to would have to be some kind of f**king idiot.

[DaveShoelace]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

The tax man would compare your window cleaner to other window cleaners on similar estates.  How does he compare sam trickett to me?

Is that what actually happens? Does HMRC look at a window cleaner who claims he earned £10,000 a year and question it based on local averages?

I'm not saying a live pro player isn't near impossible to track, but it's no different to anyone else who deals in cash. Very hard to police of course, but that's not a reason not to insist on it.

[arbboy]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

The tax man would compare your window cleaner to other window cleaners on similar estates.  How does he compare sam trickett to me?

Is that what actually happens? Does HMRC look at a window cleaner who claims he earned £10,000 a year and question it based on local averages?

I'm not saying a live pro player isn't near impossible to track, but it's no different to anyone else who deals in cash. Very hard to police of course, but that's not a reason not to insist on it.

a live window cleaner in sheffield would be much more predictable what he earns than a live 1/2 player at genting sheffield over  a year.  Plus the first £12k is tax free anyway.  how many pro gamblers actually get into higher rate tax levels?  Ie £50k+ a year earnings?  Not many.  That is where the governement really makes its money.  I have lost my personal tax allowance for 12 years because i have no taxable income.   £150k of income that i have made in that time wouldn't have been taxable anyway.

[DaveShoelace]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

The tax man would compare your window cleaner to other window cleaners on similar estates.  How does he compare sam trickett to me?  One of the only advantages of being a pro gambler is paying no tax.  There are bundles of huge disadvantages believe me.  This is why the governement will never rock the boat.  It will never generate enough tax to justify doing it even if they could collect 100% of what they were due.  They get it already from the rake box and the firms from losers anyway.  That is their view of the situation and it will never change.  If it was going to change it would have done between 2000-2015 during the boom years.  There has never been as many pro gamblers from 2015 onwards than ever before and they still have zero desire to tax them.  Nothing will change.

With respect, it sounds like you are trying to persuade yourself more than me. I agree that it's unlikely we will see a change in the near future because it's not on the HMRC's radar, but it certainly could happen, and LOL at the idea that 'no tax is the only good thing about being a pro gambler which is why the government leave us alone'.

[DaveShoelace]

how do you prove how much i have made a year in a live cash game ?  When i change all my chips into notes with other players rather than the cash desk?  Just for a start.

How does my window cleaner when I hand him a fiver once a month?

The tax man would compare your window cleaner to other window cleaners on similar estates.  How does he compare sam trickett to me?

Is that what actually happens? Does HMRC look at a window cleaner who claims he earned £10,000 a year and question it based on local averages?

I'm not saying a live pro player isn't near impossible to track, but it's no different to anyone else who deals in cash. Very hard to police of course, but that's not a reason not to insist on it.

a live window cleaner in sheffield would be much more predictable what he earns than a live 1/2 player at genting sheffield over  a year.

Agree I'm asking if HMRC question earnings as you suggested based on the earnings of similar people in the same field (genuinely asking, never heard that before).