LOST!!! (non-poker topic)

[luckyblind]

Adam I am totally on your side. Outside of poker I own shops that sell video games & dvd's. The availability of the latest Music & DVD's on the net affects not just the artists but also the retailers (and the margins on DVD's & games has already been crushed by Tesco's and the like). At a market near one of my shops on a Saturday there are stalls making more in one day than I can make in a month by selling pirate DVD'd and music. This money mostly funds the major crime rings all over the world, these people are moving into piracy as it is more cost effective and the sentences are much less than drugs or people smuggling. As long as people think that it is 'ok' to download this stuff murderers and gangs will get richer.
Whoever said it is ok to download TV shows is talking crap. Nearly all TV show are released on DVD so it is no different to copying a film.
Instead of trying to hack the white house, teenage computer geniuses should put their talents to good work and infected every single Bit torrent with a nice computer destroying virus.

Lost is great.

[Royal Flush]

. As long as people think that it is 'ok' to download this stuff murderers and gangs will get richer.

Surely if we download these things, then that takes away thier buissness aswell?!?!?!? The way these gangs get richer is if we buy it off them instead of downloading off the net.

[luckyblind]

Not really. They use these feeds to spread them across the world, saves smuggling loads of discs. One of the market traders was even brazen enough to come into my store and ask if he could use my PC to download a film as he had sold his last copy.

[Rachman]

Correct me if i'm wrong... but it isn't actually illegal to download music etc from kazaa, bit torrent and the like. The illegal bit is keeping it for longer than 24 hours or so. Personally, i download loads of stuff, if i like what i hear or see i go out and buy it. If i don't like it i delete it. "Illegal" downloading opens up a whole new market to up and coming bands who may not get any other form of exposure.

There are problems sure, but infecting all users with a virus can cost the 'honest' users thousands.

And murderers aren't really financed by organised crime... murders perpetrated by these sorts of gangs are generally just black market business rivals and users of their illegal services. I'll leave the ethics of that one up to you.

[AdamM]

"Illegal" downloading opens up a whole new market to up and coming bands who may not get any other form of exposure.

sorry mate but thats way off.

new musicians doing anything other than mainstream music are being crushed out of existance by illegal downloads and record companies taking the safe option when signing new acts. It's still possible to get picked up by some minor record label but I know guys who have done this and earn less than the people they leave behind in their home towns working in McDonalds. if you're downloading illegally or buying anything pirate you're contributing to the watered down pop idol music drivel we're having to endure at the minute. even the 'try before you buy' downloaders are having an impact. that's what a single is for. the band releases a single, if you like it after hearing it on radio / seeing the video you buy the album. if you don't like most of the album you don't buy the 2nd one and the record company drops them. but they've been fairly paid for their creative output.

I did say dont get me started again.

While I'm rantng again DON'T EVER BUY T-SHIRTS / POSTERS OUTSIDE GIGS. artists rarely make any money from touring in respect of ticket sales. once the costs have been covered they often infact make a loss (which used to eb recouped in album sales). Merch however is purely profit for the bands. a small band earns its living from T-shirt sales at gigs.

[Royal Flush]

Not really. They use these feeds to spread them across the world, saves smuggling loads of discs.

Surely then this 'gang' would use an FTP server and just transfer them to each other on that?!?!?!? Rather than giving us all copy's.

I know you meant well in the post, but STOP DIGGING!

[jbsc7769]

"new musicians doing anything other than mainstream music are being crushed out of existance by illegal downloads and record companies taking the safe option when signing new acts"

What an oxymoron if ever I saw one. Surely that is EXACTLY WHY downloading is great for new bands. The major lable are narrow minded and only want to sign the next"britney/boy band etc"

Damn, I knew we shouldn't have started this one again.

Agreed about T-Shirts sales etc although, the (major) bands could actually do more to help themselves, £25 / £30 for a t-shirt at some of the bigger events. You know better than any of us the economics of this Adam. Take into account they are dealing in bulk and it is scary.

[AdamM]

you're right about them not helping themselves with the price of merch but the fans answer should be dont buy at all, not buy from the theives outside.

You're still missing the point about downloads. perhaps legal downloading is the way forward. personally I still like my 500+ cd collection to keep growing but illegal downloading, whether to burn for personal use, burn to sell or (albeit to a lesser extent) try before you buy is having a crippling effect on new musicians.

there's no point me trying to convert anyone here because luckyblind appears to be the only person to agree with me but copyrigt theft in it's many forms is a criminal offence and I have no sympathy for anyone facing conviction, even these random test cases going through now. You can't decide which forms of theft you are against and which you aren't.

[AdamM]

just realised I'm disagreeing with the majority opinion on an internet forum and NOT being torn apart and flamed.

What a wonderful place to be.

[jbsc7769]

ha ha Adam, we are all being objective! (or objectionable!!) I have already said, I agree with practically all you have said, just not the fact it doesnt help the smaller bands and the fact that I think legal downlaods is great and the way forward. To be fair, you have now said it may be.

[Rachman]

Sorry Adam, but I can't believe you think try before you buy has a crippling effect (albeit lesser) on new musicians. I've bought countless albums from bands who i've never heard on radio or seen on TV, just because i downloaded a few of their tracks.

But hey, each to their own an all that.

[AdamM]

you are not in the majority.

most people who 'try before they buy' end up burning or transfering to ipod and never buy

[Sunday8pm]

zzzzzz

[ifm]

i agree Adam, i haven't bought an album in years and years, it is wrong but you will never make me feel guilty about it.
Ian

[AdamM]

zzzzzz

dude, thats just rude