Vagueness and the Aftermath - A sporadic diary

[gatso]

Mmmm, maybe I should have said 'proper shuffles'.

yeah, it's an absolute certainty that 2 decks have been shuffled to the same order yet highly unlikely it's ever been done with proper shuffles

[EvilPie]

Mmmm, maybe I should have said 'proper shuffles'.

yeah, it's an absolute certainty that 2 decks have been shuffled to the same order yet highly unlikely it's ever been done with proper shuffles

What's a proper shuffle though?

If you're saying there's a proper shuffle that implies that every other shuffle ever done isn't proper.

Therefore if you take 2 fresh decks and shuffle them 400 times 'properly' then they will be in exactly the same order.

It's only when you shuffle them improperly that they get randomised.

[david3103]

The 'bridge players get dealt 'perfect' hand' happens more often than you'd expect.
But just because it even happened twice doesn't in any way suggest that the decks were in the same order. All it does is show that there's a chance that the deck can be shuffled such that the cards are in spade/club/heart/diamond sequence.

[gatso]

I think what you're calling a proper shuffle would normally be known as a perfect shuffle though I'm not 100% on that

I'm gonna guess that the odds of someone accidentally performing 400 straight perfect shuffles are longer than 1 in 52!

[AndrewT]

Plenty of posters in this thread are proper shuffles.

[doubleup]

The 'bridge players get dealt 'perfect' hand' happens more often than you'd expect.
But just because it even happened twice doesn't in any way suggest that the decks were in the same order. All it does is show that there's a chance that the deck can be shuffled such that the cards are in spade/club/heart/diamond sequence.

good point, I rattled Kinboshi tho, he had to rely on "technicalities" again

[tikay]

Plenty of posters in this thread are proper shuffles.

Not all of them are playing with a full deck, though.

[kinboshi]

The 'bridge players get dealt 'perfect' hand' happens more often than you'd expect.
But just because it even happened twice doesn't in any way suggest that the decks were in the same order. All it does is show that there's a chance that the deck can be shuffled such that the cards are in spade/club/heart/diamond sequence.

good point, I rattled Kinboshi tho, he had to rely on "technicalities" again

You did, and looking at the odds of dealing those four hands, although unlikely, was billions of times more probable than the chances of two shuffles being the same. Couldn't work out what I was missing. Thanks David!

[kinboshi]

Plenty of posters in this thread are proper shuffles.

Not all of them are playing with a full deck, though.

Joker.

[doubleup]

The 'bridge players get dealt 'perfect' hand' happens more often than you'd expect.
But just because it even happened twice doesn't in any way suggest that the decks were in the same order. All it does is show that there's a chance that the deck can be shuffled such that the cards are in spade/club/heart/diamond sequence.

good point, I rattled Kinboshi tho, he had to rely on "technicalities" again

You did, and looking at the odds of dealing those four hands, although unlikely, was billions of times more probable than the chances of two shuffles being the same. Couldn't work out what I was missing. Thanks David!

.

[tikay]

I'm so glad to see that the BBC are using my licence fee in such a worthwhile and responsible fashion.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-16770489

People love that sort of nonsense, Tom. There's a thread in The Lounge about "Mediums", 8 or 9 pages in 2 days I think. Unbelievable. Literally.

See you later. 2pm start, don't be late. Don't forget there is a dress code.

Yeah! It's not as if they're discussing something controversial and emotive like cement. 

 Please! I mean, not to be rude, but you really MUST pay more attention.

We - the cultured hoity-toity - do NOT discuss cement, cement is not controversial, or emotive, it's just powder. I think we should also give it it's correct name, in most cases the term we need is “Portland Cement”, or more correctly, “Ordinary Portland Cement”, usually shortened in the trade to “OPC”.

See….

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_cement

However, it is NOT cement which we find “controversial & emotive”, it is concrete. They are very different things.

Try & think of what flour – self-raising flour if you prefer – is to a cake. The flour is just an ingredient, a basic powder, & you cannot make a cake without it, but before it becomes a cake, it needs stuff adding – egg & milk, I’m led to believe.

Same with cement, as to concrete. Cement is just a plain, rather unattractive & uninteresting powder. When we add water & aggregate to it, it becomes concrete. Now, of course, it DOES perhaps become emotive, controversial even, but one thing is for sure – it now becomes fascinating, even to the untrained eye.

Here is some concrete. I think we can agree my case is made. 

[Redsgirl]

I'm so glad to see that the BBC are using my licence fee in such a worthwhile and responsible fashion.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-16770489

People love that sort of nonsense, Tom. There's a thread in The Lounge about "Mediums", 8 or 9 pages in 2 days I think. Unbelievable. Literally.

See you later. 2pm start, don't be late. Don't forget there is a dress code.

Yeah! It's not as if they're discussing something controversial and emotive like cement. 

 Please! I mean, not to be rude, but you really MUST pay more attention.

We - the cultured hoity-toity - do NOT discuss cement, cement is not controversial, or emotive, it's just powder. I think we should also give it it's correct name, in most cases the term we need is “Portland Cement”, or more correctly, “Ordinary Portland Cement”, usually shortened in the trade to “OPC”.

See….

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portland_cement

However, it is NOT cement which we find “controversial & emotive”, it is concrete. They are very different things.

Try & think of what flour – self-raising flour if you prefer – is to a cake. The flour is just an ingredient, a basic powder, & you cannot make a cake without it, but before it becomes a cake, it needs stuff adding – egg & milk, I’m led to believe.

Same with cement, as to concrete. Cement is just a plain, rather unattractive & uninteresting powder. When we add water & aggregate to it, it becomes concrete. Now, of course, it DOES perhaps become emotive, controversial even, but one thing is for sure – it now becomes fascinating, even to the untrained eye.

Here is some concrete. I think we can agree my case is made. 

Dear, dear Tikay, I stand corrected.
You have my undying grattiude for enriching my life with these incredible facts.
Who knows what downward spiral I would have embarked upon without you enlightening me.
I am going to spend the next few hours contemplating this beautiful photo, while quietly weeping with joy and wonder.

[tikay]

Quality response, Redsgirl, proper chip off the block, you.

Dad must, as they say in racehorse breeding circles, stamp his stock.

I have a whole gallery of photographs of concrete, just say the word & I will share them with you.

[Laxie]

The world has officially gone mad

[Simon Galloway]

Flourless cake...