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Author Topic: Vagueness and the Aftermath - A sporadic diary  (Read 4548206 times)
RED-DOG
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« Reply #735 on: March 15, 2008, 02:41:48 AM »

Red, hoping for some advice here if the Lurgy's not laid you low.

THe folk's new pup Kerry has been a wild wee thing, but fairly obedient, learning not to go in the front room very quickly, not going out of the gate if out on her own in the garden etc, but the last week she's discovered rabbits & seems to have gained the confidence to go streaking off into the distance to look for them, not caring if we're shouting for her to come back.

This isn't being helped by my Dad's bad leg which is reducing his mobility so the wee terror knows she can outmanouvre him.

Any advice as it's got the folks pulling their hair out.


Getting a dog to come to you when you call it, every time, (not just 19 times out of 20) but EVERY SINGLE TIME, is one of the most important, and yet one of the easiest things to teach. It's also the thing that most people make a hash of.

Once you have made a hash of it, it ceases to be one of the easiest things to teach, and becomes one of the most difficult.

Let me try to explain why this particular command causes so much trouble.

Virtually any other command you give is enforceable. Tell her to sit. If she ignores you, you can push her bottom to the ground. Tell her to stay out of the front room. If she ignores you, you can throw her out.

You can't force her to come back to you when she's running free, you can only ask her.

The solution is simple, but you have to be 100% consistant.

NEVER CALL HER UNLESS YOU KNOW FOR CERTAIN THAT SHE WILL COME.

It's pointless to call her when she's chasing rabbits and you know she won't come. Think about it. All you are teaching her is to disobey you. You are demonstrating to her that she can get away with it. After a very short time indeed, she won't even hear you. She really won't. It's called "Deffing out" She's having a whale of a time folowing the instincts that have been bred into her for thousands of years, why on earth should she stop?

You have taught her that she doesn't have to come. Every time you call her and he doesn't come, you are re enforcing that lesson.

Even if you give her a jolly good hiding when you do get hold of her, in her mind she's being punished not for running away, but for COMING BACK!

NEVER CALL HER UNLESS YOU KNOW FOR CERTAIN THAT SHE WILL COME!

OK, lets look at the other side of the coin. Instead of calling her when she doesn't want to come, call her when she does.

If you have any dog sense at all, you will know the times when she will come to you. Dinner time, play time, just come home from the shop time, whatever. it doesn't matter, as long as you know she will come.

Let her see you preparing her dinner, but have someone hold her until you call her name. Then have someone hold her while you hide around a corner and make her dinner, but make sure she can hear or smell you doing it. Call her name and let them release her, she will be there like a shot.

Basically what you're looking for here is a conditioned response. She hears her name called, she comes. She doesn't think. She doesn't need to. IT'S ALWAYS SOMETHING GOOD!

Once you have that 100% "Comes first time every time" response, it will be there for ever. Your dog will come when called, even if it knows that you want it for something unpleasant. BUT YOU HAVE TO GET THERE FIRST.

One last point regarding your particular situation. If you do let her run free to chase rabbits, resign yourself to the fact that you will probably never be able to call her back while she is doing that. The hunting instinct is too strong, and the spark in her has already become a flame.

The only solution to that would be to put her off chasing rabbits for ever. I've done that a couple of times, but that's another story.
 
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 11:36:13 AM by RED-DOG » Logged

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« Reply #736 on: March 15, 2008, 02:51:43 AM »

Just read that back, and I came off a bit schoolmasterish  (Sorry Mr P).
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Bainn
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« Reply #737 on: March 15, 2008, 02:57:52 AM »

Tis great reading this, more please, NOW !
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« Reply #738 on: March 15, 2008, 08:54:36 AM »

Your talents are lost to most.  Book?  You could have yer own telly show and put Indy to shame.
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« Reply #739 on: March 15, 2008, 09:04:18 AM »

Just read that back, and I came off a bit schoolmasterish  (Sorry Mr P).

No Tom, they're much appreciated.

I think I'll ask my mate about the rabbit thing - he has Kerry's dad & step-brother & poaches rabbits with them - but somehow has them trained to come back - I haven't a clue how he does it.

We're not too upset about the rabbit chaser - it's natural to her - we want her to come back when the rabbit's got away - NOT to go looking for more.
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« Reply #740 on: March 15, 2008, 10:10:39 AM »

Just read that back, and I came off a bit schoolmasterish  (Sorry Mr P).



I think I'll ask my mate about the rabbit thing - he has Kerry's dad & step-brother & poaches rabbits with them - but somehow has them trained to come back - I haven't a clue how he does it.


I bet if you ask him, he hasn't a clue how he does it either.

Initially, he probably didn't try to recall the dogs while they were chasing rabbits.

The best teachers usually don't even realise that they are teaching, they just develop a working relationship with the dog.

Your friends dogs will have quickly learned that by listening to him, they stand a much better chance of actually catching a rabbit anyway. He isn't fighting the dogs instincts, he's working with them.

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Rod Paradise
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« Reply #741 on: March 15, 2008, 10:51:48 AM »

Just read that back, and I came off a bit schoolmasterish  (Sorry Mr P).



I think I'll ask my mate about the rabbit thing - he has Kerry's dad & step-brother & poaches rabbits with them - but somehow has them trained to come back - I haven't a clue how he does it.


I bet if you ask him, he hasn't a clue how he does it either.

Initially, he probably didn't try to recall the dogs while they were chasing rabbits.

The best teachers usually don't even realise that they are teaching, they just develop a working relationship with the dog.

Your friends dogs will have quickly learned that by listening to him, they stand a much better chance of actually catching a rabbit anyway. He isn't fighting the dogs instincts, he's working with them.



Good point.

I think we're having more trouble with the wee yin for a few reasons:

  • She's the first really young puppy we've had in about 25 years (other dogs have been rehomed young dogs)
  • My Dad got an infection in his leg just before her final jab and wasn't walking wel enough when she was first taken out, so hasn't been able to do the intensive early training like he's done with all our other dogs
  • This is our first little dog & my Mum's confident with walking her - and doesn't discipline like my Dad or I would
  • She's too flaming clever & cocky by half Smiley, we've had dopey labs & shy dalmations, Kerry's damn quick to learn, but has a lot of devilment in her

BTW  Red I've just spent half an hour extracting 17 pages of Henry's Mare's story to print out for my Dad (who's not into reading things on computers) & have left the room as he's got to the end because he gets annoyed if you catch him with a lump in his throat & a tear in his eye... You really should think about getting a collection together for publishing.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 10:54:44 AM by Rod Paradise » Logged

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« Reply #742 on: March 15, 2008, 11:03:05 AM »

Thank you Rod.

I wil have to meet your dad one of these days, I know we would get on. He and I could spend an hour or so slagging the youth of today (You) off.
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« Reply #743 on: March 15, 2008, 11:34:30 AM »

Thank you Rod.

I wil have to meet your dad one of these days, I know we would get on. He and I could spend an hour or so slagging the youth of today (You) off.

My Dad says anytime - there's room for a caravan, or room in the house and a lot of beautiful counryside.
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« Reply #744 on: March 15, 2008, 02:02:03 PM »

This morning I was playing two tables of $2/4 cash when my eldest daughter Muzelley arrived, along with several grandkids and a big roll of that artificial grass-carpet stuff. She asked me to help drape it over the fence so that she could hose it down.

I asked my youngest daughter Bridie to just watch my cards while I was outside helping her sister, and to call me if I got any big pairs.

When I came back inside I noticed that there was about $120 more in my stack than there was when I left and I asked her where it came from.


"Oh" she replied, "I was on the big blind with Q6os and flopped two pair, so I checked it and someone bet out. The turn was a blank so I checked again, he bet, and I came over the top for his last 60 bucks. he has top pair and gets no help on the river, SHIPPP!!!"

"Er yes...right....thanks....."


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« Reply #745 on: March 15, 2008, 02:14:44 PM »

This morning I was playing two tables of $2/4 cash when my eldest daughter Muzelley arrived, along with several grandkids and a big roll of that artificial grass-carpet stuff. She asked me to help drape it over the fence so that she could hose it down.

I asked my youngest daughter Bridie to just watch my cards while I was outside helping her sister, and to call me if I got any big pairs.

When I came back inside I noticed that there was about $120 more in my stack than there was when I left and I asked her where it came from.


"Oh" she replied, "I was on the big blind with Q6os and flopped two pair, so I checked it and someone bet out. The turn was a blank so I checked again, he bet, and I came over the top for his last 60 bucks. he has top pair and gets no help on the river, SHIPPP!!!"

"Er yes...right....thanks....."




LMAO ... thats quality !!
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« Reply #746 on: March 15, 2008, 03:06:27 PM »

This morning I was playing two tables of $2/4 cash when my eldest daughter Muzelley arrived, along with several grandkids and a big roll of that artificial grass-carpet stuff. She asked me to help drape it over the fence so that she could hose it down.

I asked my youngest daughter Bridie to just watch my cards while I was outside helping her sister, and to call me if I got any big pairs.

When I came back inside I noticed that there was about $120 more in my stack than there was when I left and I asked her where it came from.


"Oh" she replied, "I was on the big blind with Q6os and flopped two pair, so I checked it and someone bet out. The turn was a blank so I checked again, he bet, and I came over the top for his last 60 bucks. he has top pair and gets no help on the river, SHIPPP!!!"

"Er yes...right....thanks....."




lol
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« Reply #747 on: March 15, 2008, 03:11:29 PM »

We knew there had to be a poker player in the family somewhere.
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« Reply #748 on: March 15, 2008, 03:12:24 PM »

We knew there had to be a poker player in the family somewhere.

Yeah but I just thought Red ate him.
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« Reply #749 on: March 15, 2008, 03:13:34 PM »

This morning I was playing two tables of $2/4 cash when my eldest daughter Muzelley arrived, along with several grandkids and a big roll of that artificial grass-carpet stuff. She asked me to help drape it over the fence so that she could hose it down.

I asked my youngest daughter Bridie to just watch my cards while I was outside helping her sister, and to call me if I got any big pairs.

When I came back inside I noticed that there was about $120 more in my stack than there was when I left and I asked her where it came from.


"Oh" she replied, "I was on the big blind with Q6os and flopped two pair, so I checked it and someone bet out. The turn was a blank so I checked again, he bet, and I came over the top for his last 60 bucks. he has top pair and gets no help on the river, SHIPPP!!!"

"Er yes...right....thanks....."




I love it, would you say it took longer to train one of your dogs to stop chasing rabbits or your daughter to play a hand as well as that? ;o)
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