Prose from a Poshboy

[Free_Rollin]

£30-40k

I think playing the £2/£5 off a £20k-£25k roll is fine. But it depends on your style a lot. If you're going to play LAG, your swings will obviously be higher. Game selection will be more important the higher you go. Sitting in a £1/£2 game, chances are you're going to be pretty comfortable in the majority of line ups. This probably won't be the case in every £2/£5+ game.

When I was playing a game that I wasn't rolled for last year, I'd be playing pretty tight. However in the £1/£2 games I was playing like a lunatic. Seemed to work pretty well.

To play £2/£5 (at DTD when it runs) anything less than a £1k buy in is shortstacking.
£20 - £25k is much too short for anything except taking shots.

Haven't been to DTD in ages (miss you Neil!!) so not sure how deep the games are at DTD. Before it used to be players like Rob covering, 2 - 3 players having £2k-£3k, and remaining players hovering around £500-£1500 mark.

Even if you're buying in for £1k, pretty sure £20k-£25k is fine. You're going to be one tabling, the games weren't super tough (not sure about today), plus live players just don't take enough optimum lines or apply enough pressure for you to require a bankroll similar to online requirements. Not saying if Alex decided to play £2/£5 with £25k he definitely won't go broke, but if he thinks he has an edge in the game he sits in, I'd say £25k is enough.

[Free_Rollin]

Also, I'm just answering bankroll questions on a general basis, not advising what Alex should do now given his recent bink.

[jakally]

Haven't been to DTD in ages (miss you Neil!!) so not sure how deep the games are at DTD. Before it used to be players like Rob covering, 2 - 3 players having £2k-£3k, and remaining players hovering around £500-£1500 mark.

Even if you're buying in for £1k, pretty sure £20k-£25k is fine. You're going to be one tabling, the games weren't super tough (not sure about today), plus live players just don't take enough optimum lines or apply enough pressure for you to require a bankroll similar to online requirements. Not saying if Alex decided to play £2/£5 with £25k he definitely won't go broke, but if he thinks he has an edge in the game he sits in, I'd say £25k is enough.

I'm a bankroll nit.
Nothing wrong with playing £2/£5 regularly with that roll, as long as you understand the risks.
Be quite easy to turn a £25k roll, into a £15k one, without doing much wrong.
In Alex's case, that would, to some extent, feel like being back to square one.

Any plans to come up to DTD soon mate? Be good to see you.

[Longy]

Surely a solution to this is for Alex to play 1/2 on his own dime and be staked for any higher games that run. Obviously that is dependent on finding stakers being happy with that kind of deal.

[mondatoo]

i dont want to piss on anyones parade here but Alex has won one years wage here after deductions. i dont think it is even possible for him to make a decent living in a £1/£2 game (which often sits with 4/5 mates all trying to eat off the same table and with some rakes the game is impossible for 4 people to break even from let alone make a wage)  especially when he has to live on his own and along comes wife kids and all the responsibility.

You need to be realistic in the fact that Alex was struggling before keith and james came along to back him in the £1/£2 game. i read that you were going on your own now which i thought was a joke but having just read Skolsuper's post i aint sure. i would now step upto £2/£5 but you have to do this with the financial security of being backed by those two. i know you will have given keith and James an excellent roi but surely staying under their wing has to be more sensible option.

my advice if you go on your own would be give a substantial amount 10k/15k to the parents to look after, enjoy a large chunk on holidays and being balla with  Hannah then add 10k to your poker roll. In 6 month time you will know if or not you are doing the right thing and can re evaluate.

good luck and dont follow Amy Winehouse

None of this post makes any sense.

If Alex solely played 1/2 with a 20k+ roll and wen't broke I'd think it's fair to say he should get a "real" job, or stick to luckboxing donkaments.

[smashedagain]

Alex was struggling before keith and james came along to back him in the £1/£2 game. i read that you were going on your own now which i thought was a joke but having just read Skolsuper's post i aint sure. i would now step upto £2/£5 but you have to do this with the financial security of being backed by those two. i know you will have given keith and James an excellent roi but surely staying under their wing has to be more sensible option.

Don't like this advice much.

AFAIK Alex's profit at £1/£2 since being staked has been pretty good, and the main reason for being staked was being under-rolled.
The money he's been lumping over to Keith and James is much better in his pocket, and it's a no-brainer to start playing under his own dime.

The £2/£5 games run infrequently, and are, on average, tougher than the £1/£2 games.
Alex is right, playing sometimes, and game selecting is ok, but trying to make a living from them, particularly being staked, is not.

hey neil, my advice to Alex is just going from experience and you are 100% correct he is better off with the money in his own pocket.

 but my point is as a professional he has to make a living in the long term, which i am yet to be convinced you can at £1/£2.  £2/£5 and £5/£10 are all the same country wide in that they contain a mixture of business people with pure till (lots of dough) or people who make money from illegal means. Alex does not have the roll to live with people who can lose 3 or 4 bag and it means nothing because they are earning that money in a few days anyway. you know how many people actually make a living off poker in the long term and it equates to 1 person sat at the table (or even less in some of the games that charge rape and not rake).

my arguement if it holds water is that he cant make a living at £1/£2 so should be in the bigger games to judge his ability. to be in the bigger games he needs to still be backed by the two legends without a shadow of a doubt. i understand you are good mates with Alex but you cant honestly think that letting him out on his own is good.

ray a 20k roll is obv enough to play £1/£2 but is the game big enough to at least double your 20k year on year, year in year out. Alex does not live with mum n dad and will need £20k a year to survive. one break even year kills his bankroll  (thats break even not losing year) and when you consider he is sat with Nick,Mitch, Simon, Stato, too many Toms most nights of the week then this situation is surely gonna end in tears. game selection is mostly bollocks on school nights and it means that your mates are going after the same spots as you are.

[jakally]

my arguement if it holds water is that he cant make a living at £1/£2 so should be in the bigger games to judge his ability. to be in the bigger games he needs to still be backed by the two legends without a shadow of a doubt. i understand you are good mates with Alex but you cant honestly think that letting him out on his own is good.

You are right, getting staked for bigger games (and MTT's) is still maybe a good route.
However, I'm pretty sure Alex can make a living at £1/£2 (and £0.50/£1 when needs must) as long as he continues to put the hours in.

Think he's got his head in the right place though, so will happily ignore any ramblings from an old pair of nits, and make some good, sensible, decisions on how to move forward.

[George2Loose]

Own dime 1/2 no brainer imo. Build your roll then start playing 2/5. What's the rush? A few months ago you had nada and were worrying about playing .50/1

And keep hold of that tourney win buzz. Nothing like it. You gonna be playing more UKIPT's etc or stick to cash?

[StuartHopkin]

(miss you Neil!!)

Any plans to come up to DTD soon mate? Be good to see you.

I miss you too Neil, are you up at any point Sunny I will try and get in for a game. I will even play 2/5 with you big boys.

[Longy]

What kind of bb/100 can a comptent live £1/2 player expect to make? Obv from there it should be relatively easy to do the maths and off we go.

Alex is going to love we are rehashing the same arguement for about the 5th time, but it intrigues me in a geeky way comparison of live/online winrates etc.

[mondatoo]

Alex was struggling before keith and james came along to back him in the £1/£2 game. i read that you were going on your own now which i thought was a joke but having just read Skolsuper's post i aint sure. i would now step upto £2/£5 but you have to do this with the financial security of being backed by those two. i know you will have given keith and James an excellent roi but surely staying under their wing has to be more sensible option.

Don't like this advice much.

AFAIK Alex's profit at £1/£2 since being staked has been pretty good, and the main reason for being staked was being under-rolled.
The money he's been lumping over to Keith and James is much better in his pocket, and it's a no-brainer to start playing under his own dime.

The £2/£5 games run infrequently, and are, on average, tougher than the £1/£2 games.
Alex is right, playing sometimes, and game selecting is ok, but trying to make a living from them, particularly being staked, is not.

hey neil, my advice to Alex is just going from experience and you are 100% correct he is better off with the money in his own pocket.

 but my point is as a professional he has to make a living in the long term, which i am yet to be convinced you can at £1/£2.  £2/£5 and £5/£10 are all the same country wide in that they contain a mixture of business people with pure till (lots of dough) or people who make money from illegal means. Alex does not have the roll to live with people who can lose 3 or 4 bag and it means nothing because they are earning that money in a few days anyway. you know how many people actually make a living off poker in the long term and it equates to 1 person sat at the table (or even less in some of the games that charge rape and not rake).

my arguement if it holds water is that he cant make a living at £1/£2 so should be in the bigger games to judge his ability. to be in the bigger games he needs to still be backed by the two legends without a shadow of a doubt. i understand you are good mates with Alex but you cant honestly think that letting him out on his own is good.

ray a 20k roll is obv enough to play £1/£2 but is the game big enough to at least double your 20k year on year, year in year out. Alex does not live with mum n dad and will need £20k a year to survive. one break even year kills his bankroll  (thats break even not losing year) and when you consider he is sat with Nick,Mitch, Simon, Stato, too many Toms most nights of the week then this situation is surely gonna end in tears. game selection is mostly bollocks on school nights and it means that your mates are going after the same spots as you are.

Just thought a lot of your advice was contradictory, such as his roll could be gone within a year but then advise him to spend money being balla on holidays and his gf ?

Or the fact that he was struggling, as far as I remember he had a couple of bad months and messed up a bit with money, I'm sure that will be a good learning curve for him this time, or maybe not if he's a bit daft like me 

[smashedagain]

my arguement if it holds water is that he cant make a living at £1/£2 so should be in the bigger games to judge his ability. to be in the bigger games he needs to still be backed by the two legends without a shadow of a doubt. i understand you are good mates with Alex but you cant honestly think that letting him out on his own is good.

You are right, getting staked for bigger games (and MTT's) is still maybe a good route.
However, I'm pretty sure Alex can make a living at £1/£2 (and £0.50/£1 when needs must) as long as he continues to put the hours in.

Think he's got his head in the right place though, so will happily ignore any ramblings from an old pair of nits, and make some good, sensible, decisions on how to move forward.

you need to take some money out ray, my idea of balla is giving the wife 50% to spend on the kids. he has to enjoy some of the money or at least have something to show for it. i have seen far too many guys bink 10/ 20 bags and just give it to the casino.

just look at the guys who have been in the game 20 years and continue to play 5/10+ five nights a week. take a look at their style, game selection and bankroll management. Yo Yo once said "one Ept is not enough to retire on" and he has had plenty of other scores too

[dik9]

Just a note about the DTD cash games
Average buy-in for the £1/2 no cap is probably £1k
£2/5 when it runs is probably average stack £3k
£5/10 is probably about £5k

Don't know what the average buy in is at Gala but DTD plays pretty deep

[George2Loose]

Just a note about the DTD cash games
Average buy-in for the £1/2 no cap is probably £1k
£2/5 when it runs is probably average stack £3k
£5/10 is probably about £5k

Don't know what the average buy in is at Gala but DTD plays pretty deep

Are these averages or estimates? Cos I've never sat in a 1/2 game where the aveage is 1k

[cambridgealex]

Just a note about the DTD cash games
Average buy-in for the £1/2 no cap is probably £1k

nooooo, nobody buys in for 1k? last night was uncapped with all the big guns and ppl started with 500. Sometimes ppl join the game late and sit with 700+ to cover fish who have spun up, but even so, no way average is 1k.

yes it is fascinating having the same discussion for the 6th time, just with different numbers this time. I'm just not going to take part and get back to playing with my brand new shiny iPad! Wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii!