Markup??

[kinboshi]

I am not sure if it is sometimes supply and demand? I am sure there are a few members on here that have took a % in someone as just a punt rather than considering the mark up they have advertised at.

What is that, if not supply and demand?

[gouty]

No one has mentioned expenses.

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

So really 1.12 is kinda break even? It's gotta be minus EV for anyone to sell at spot, or am I wrong?

[Marky147]

No one has mentioned expenses.

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

So really 1.12 is kinda break even? It's gotta be minus EV for anyone to sell at spot, or am I wrong?

[skolsuper]

No one has mentioned expenses.

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

So really 1.12 is kinda break even? It's gotta be minus EV for anyone to sell at spot, or am I wrong?

You're right, but nobody will agree with you here

[Boba Fett]

I am not sure if it is sometimes supply and demand? I am sure there are a few members on here that have took a % in someone as just a punt rather than considering the mark up they have advertised at.

You can go back pages in this thread and someone mentioned about Daniel Morgan being able to sell his package at 1.6, because it's a 'soft' field and full of businessmen, etc. But everyone else who I can remember was selling at max 1.3 & are far better players. I think some people actually keep on adding to their mark up as they think about it even more, by thinking "I think I am 1.15, but I'll round it upto 1.2"

There isn't many people in the staking boards who are anywhere near the mark up they are selling at. The only who is perhaps close is Alex & fair play to him.

As for John Black, I try to keep up with most diaries on here, but everytime I read his diary it is a HH from a live cash game, no mark up needed imo.

I sell now and again and always at a very decent rate.

Do you play with Dan a lot so you know how good he is?

Pretty ridic post all round really.  I opened up the 7 other Main Event staking threads from blonde this year and the markups were 1.56, 1.4, 1.5, 1.4, 1.5, 1.5, 1.2 and without going onto 2p2 to check Im pretty sure I remeber from the time not many people selling for less than 1.3 so i dunno where you got all these players selling at max 1.3 that are better than Dan Morgan thing from.

The closest person to good value ont he staking board is one of the people that auctions most of their action ensuring they sell for the absolute maximum people will pay at?

And lol @ deciding John should sell at spot purely from reading his diary

PS- wp if you're just a serial troll

[Marky147]

No one has mentioned expenses.

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

So really 1.12 is kinda break even? It's gotta be minus EV for anyone to sell at spot, or am I wrong?

You're right, but nobody will agree with you here

I have only ever bought action infrequently and for very minor amounts relative to the more serious stakers like yourself, but I always thought  from the perspective that the markup I paid was for their playing ability and they wouldn't be factoring their expenses into it.

I rarely sold action here either, I think only twice that I can remember and only once at markup when there were still plenty of fish. I sold the action to cover expenses in the first instance, but the markup was only because I felt I was worth it and not to ensure all expenses were covered.

Given what's transpired since then and how much has come to light with regards to staking, I most likely wasn't worth the markup even back then and definitely wouldn't be now even though I think I'm a +ev investment in an average live comp.

When I put my staking thread up for Vegas last year, again I was pretty sure that I'd be worth 1.2  in the expected field at Binions, but for the sake of the extra $100 or so bucks I would make from selling at that I decided to just sell at spot. Also that way avoiding any possible aggro with asking for markup and also try to get it through without being told I should lower it to 0.8 

All I mean is that I wouldn't dream of marking up anything I sold, so that I could cover expenses when I'm off on a trip to Vegas and be able to eat more fillet steaks instead of Denny's while I'm away. It just seems wrong to me, but I'm obviously looking at it as someone who is now a recreational player and not doing it for 'work' anymore. Would you factor in expenses to your markup because for you it's work and therefore any costs associated with the trip come as part of the package?

Just trying to get my head around it and I'm quite sure that once explained I'll realise that I've always been thinking about it wrong.
 

[jgcblack]

No one has mentioned expenses.

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

So really 1.12 is kinda break even? It's gotta be minus EV for anyone to sell at spot, or am I wrong?

You're right, but nobody will agree with you here

What happens when a tournament/ game is a long way away?  e.g. someone going just for the ME, or maybe even the Aussie???

[Boba Fett]

Can't factor in expenses to markup. That's ridic. It's the players choice to the tourney so they should incur the expenses. Next online players will be adding electricity and Internet costs to their markup

[Royal Flush]

Just remember if in doubt you could always take advantage of the good natured community spirit on here and run an auction, fuck the rest take as much money as you can....

[pleno1]

I am not sure if it is sometimes supply and demand? I am sure there are a few members on here that have took a % in someone as just a punt rather than considering the mark up they have advertised at.

You can go back pages in this thread and someone mentioned about Daniel Morgan being able to sell his package at 1.6, because it's a 'soft' field and full of businessmen, etc. But everyone else who I can remember was selling at max 1.3 & are far better players. I think some people actually keep on adding to their mark up as they think about it even more, by thinking "I think I am 1.15, but I'll round it upto 1.2"

There isn't many people in the staking boards who are anywhere near the mark up they are selling at. The only who is perhaps close is Alex & fair play to him.

As for John Black, I try to keep up with most diaries on here, but everytime I read his diary it is a HH from a live cash game, no mark up needed imo.

I sell now and again and always at a very decent rate.

How do you know how good dan is and what makes you the guy to judge? Because e doesn't have a big hendon mob? There's people I speak to every day that have 0 hendon mov scores that I would pay 1.5 in the main

[MC]

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

Agree with this. There is also time and effort to consider. As an extreme example, I sure am going to grind the WSOP main event at 1.0 when it takes 2 weeks to make the final table whilst, as you say, the other person has to do absolutely nothing.

[jakally]

When you are sat on your fat arse in Blighty having a punt on a Blonde in Prague/Vegas or wherever surely you would expect to pay some mark up for expenses the player is gonna pay.

Agree with this. There is also time and effort to consider. As an extreme example, I sure am going to grind the WSOP main event at 1.0 when it takes 2 weeks to make the final table whilst, as you say, the other person has to do absolutely nothing.

But if you want to sell at a mark up, technically, you should be selling because you have an ROI above that figure, and not purely because you have to invest time and expense.
If someone charges a mark up, and quotes 'expenses', it would feel like I'm freerolling a holiday for them, if I buy.

[david3103]

Given that pretty much 100% of staking proposals include the 'juice' there's already an implied mark up if ROI comparisons are being made.
Selling 10% of a DTD £300 at £33.60 is selling the prize pool at 1.12

I've sold a few pieces of myself for DTD events in the past 6 months and pitched it at 1.16 generally to round off the numbers for calculating the stake.
I sold the CPP package at $30 for 1% but the entry cost was $2700+$300 so that was 1.11 effective.

Back to the thread's purpose.

John, I don't know if you're worth a mark up of 1.2, 1.3 or whatever, but if I can sell 30% at 1.16 then for sure you can.

[Cf]

Given that pretty much 100% of staking proposals include the 'juice' there's already an implied mark up if ROI comparisons are being made.
Selling 10% of a DTD £300 at £33.60 is selling the prize pool at 1.12

This is a good point and one I'd considered myself. I think in general though we all accept the reg fee to be part of the tournament buyin.

Personally I think charging for expenses is ok in certain situations. I generally don't bother due to arguments it'd cause but say I decide to go play the DTD £300. I can either drive home and not get much sleep or book a hotel and get a decent nights sleep. It's in my interest and the backer's interest for me to get the hotel. Let's say the hotel is £50 then the overal cost is:

£300 entry
£36 juice
£50 hotel
= £386

So 10% here would be £38.60 - a markup of 1.286. Given any backers are going to get an equal share with me of any prize money then I think it fair this expense is included in the package - otherwise the tournament is more profitable for the backer than it is for me, and that's not even including the effort required by the player.

The difference for me comes down to "would that expense be incurred anyway?". So food/drink etc I'd never dream of including. But in my case I wouldn't play the tournament if I didn't get the staking. So it's not like i'd be paying the £50 regardless. So in that sense I think it's fair to include it in the cost of the tournament.

One final point is my staking requests are few and far between and are generally one offs. If I ask for staking it's because I want to play a tournament and am seeking financial help to do so. In this instance I'm more inclined to write off the expense as the staking is allowing me to play a tournament I'd otherwise not get to play.

[smashedagain]

I am not sure if it is sometimes supply and demand? I am sure there are a few members on here that have took a % in someone as just a punt rather than considering the mark up they have advertised at.

You can go back pages in this thread and someone mentioned about Daniel Morgan being able to sell his package at 1.6, because it's a 'soft' field and full of businessmen, etc. But everyone else who I can remember was selling at max 1.3 & are far better players. I think some people actually keep on adding to their mark up as they think about it even more, by thinking "I think I am 1.15, but I'll round it upto 1.2"

There isn't many people in the staking boards who are anywhere near the mark up they are selling at. The only who is perhaps close is Alex & fair play to him.

As for John Black, I try to keep up with most diaries on here, but everytime I read his diary it is a HH from a live cash game, no mark up needed imo.

I sell now and again and always at a very decent rate.

How do you know how good dan is and what makes you the guy to judge? Because e doesn't have a big hendon mob? There's people I speak to every day that have 0 hendon mov scores that I would pay 1.5 in the main

if you had not lost your debit card again