FOBT's

[redarmi]

Tikay, from later this year there will be big change to online betting, including slots when I falls under UK Gamblng Commission control.

Everything in the world of gambling is being reviewed, including advertising, stakes, operator/developed/test house licensing, and more.

I can only comment on online and FOBT slots, as that's the field I work in, but there's a big focus on fair and open gambling at all times. The rules of the games are clearly stated, as are the RTPs. No game cheats the player or manipulate results. There are no false near misses shown or wins thrown away. Everything is completely random and thoroughly independently tested.

Play or don't play, it's your choice, and if you lose control over that choice and it becomes a compulsion, seek help.

Banning FOBTs to prevent gambling problems is like banning only Whisky and expecting it to reduce alcoholism in the population.

In that example banning Whiksy will stop Whiskey only drinkers from drinking therefore it will reduce alcohol problems in the population.  It won't solve all the problems but it will help.  Banning FOBT's will reduce problem gambling within the poorest and most vunerable sectors of society.  That's fact.  For many of these people they don't have access to bank accounts/internet access and deal in cash.  Therefore to fund their roulette habit they will have to find a casino, stroll up to it suitably attired, join and give ID in order to enter (which many illegally in this country with no bank account who operate in cash only) won't be able to provide.  It will not stop every roulette punter from switching from FOBT's to casino gambling but believe me it will have a major impact.  

I don't think using whisky is a great example.  It is more like banning special brew type beers and ciders.  It might not have a huge overall effect but it will reduce the impact on the most vunerable and make their lives a bit more manageable.

[arbboy]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2607329/75-voters-want-curb-100-spin-slot-machines.html

More media articles regarding FOBT's today albeit written by the horrible DailyMail who show pictures of pub fruit machines and call them FOBT's!

[AdamM]

For balance, search out the UKGC's gambling prevalence studies.
No one is pretending there aren't problem gamblers, but the daily mail is not a good source for balanced information:-)

[Kmac84]

I would ban fruit machines, FOBTs and virtual racing.

There is something that doesn't sit right with me that allows a corporate to create a rigged game that has the sole purpose of extracting money from a weak minded punter.  If you want a rigged game, then go to the casino, where at least it has a bit of theatre, and more importantly it's a hassle for someone to go there.

Bookies have their place (and I love a bet as much as the next man) but restrict their offerings to "real" events.  If there is no horse racing on a particular day, then close the shop.

That's pretty much my opinion.  I've been hassled in every bookies I have been in this last week to sign their "enoughs enough" petition! When you question them about the petition its comedy to see some of the responses.  When you give them a bit of info about taxation etc they back track and change their patter while your in the shop.

[redarmi]

I can't wait until I am back in a few weeks and go in a shop for a bet and they ask me to sign it.  I will wait to see if they will lay me a bet before signing.

[gouty]

I think it's more about educating people about gambling earlier in life that is key. We all understand -EV situations because we either play poker for a living or it's our favourite pastime. So we come across lots of poor betting decisions every day and decline to take them many many times during a game of poker.

Some people just don't get it. I have told a mate last week who I felt could have problem playing FOBTs "35/1 about a 36/1 shot every 20 seconds does not sound great over an hour, does it"?

He just went on about zero coming in a lot in some shop along the road. They should have classes at school to explain margins and house edge so people understand it's a punt, not a means of income. He actually thinks he can beat the game and does not get the concept I am trying to get across?  Is that delusion or is this a hard aspect to grasp? Another mate punts like fuck on anything he thinks he is at least 50/50 on (buckaroo game in pub or random seat last longers in tourneys) but he would never play any house game or FOBT. So it's not the gambler aspect of the problem gambler it's the fact they think they can beat the game. Is this all rubbish?

[arbboy]

I think it's more about educating people about gambling earlier in life that is key. We all understand -EV situations because we either play poker for a living or it's our favourite pastime. So we come across lots of poor betting decisions every day and decline to take them many many times during a game of poker.

Some people just don't get it. I have told a mate last week who I felt could have problem playing FOBTs "35/1 about a 36/1 shot every 20 seconds does not sound great over an hour, does it"?

He just went on about zero coming in a lot in some shop along the road. They should have classes at school to explain margins and house edge so people understand it's a punt, not a means of income. He actually thinks he can beat the game and does not get the concept I am trying to get across?  Is that delusion or is this a hard aspect to grasp? Another mate punts like fuck on anything he thinks he is at least 50/50 on (buckaroo game in pub or random seat last longers in tourneys) but he would never play any house game or FOBT. So it's not the gambler aspect of the problem gambler it's the fact they think they can beat the game. Is this all rubbish?

Lessons in school on gambling is rubbish tbf!  Never going to happen in a million years. 

[bagel]

why is it rubbish?

doubt gouty is talking about teaching 6 year olds the perils of not doing a lucky 15.

aimed at sixth formers ie 16 or 17year old i think its a good idea even if it was just discussed as part of a maths lesson.

pretty sure it would be more useful than learning how to work out the area of a circle.

[arbboy]

90% of kids in a standard 6th form college will never place a bet in their life anyway.  make that 99.5% for the girls. 

[bagel]

so what you are saying is that it would be useful for 10% of the average sixth form college. which is an awful lot of people nationwide.

glad we agree on something.

[arbboy]

I think if something like that is going to be put into education it will be something along the lines of what Martin Lewis is campaigning for, financial education regarding loans/mortgages/budgeting etc which would clearly benefit 100% of kids.  The chances of gambling being taught ahead of this which ML has been campaigning for years for are literally zero.

[Cf]

Probability is taught in secondary schools.

Topics such as EV though don't really come up until A Level. GCSE stuff even at A* level is quite basic. Grade C stuff is laughably straightforward.

The reason for this is probably that most kids really struggle with it. A lot of adults do to come to that. Hence you've got your friend there who just doesn't get that he can't beat the game.

[Kmac84]

Moving off in tangents but education is certainly key to stopping kids becoming addicted to these machines. I am all for what Martin Lewis has been trying to do, it just makes so much sense on many levels. 

I'd also say that Arbboy has pretty much nailed it throughout this thread with his take on it.  I wanted to make very similar points but I have been on the couch with a hangover all day.  Not conducive for writing wordy replies. 

[redarmi]

Moving off in tangents but education is certainly key to stopping kids becoming addicted to these machines. I am all for what Martin Lewis has been trying to do, it just makes so much sense on many levels. 

I'd also say that Arbboy has pretty much nailed it throughout this thread with his take on it.  I wanted to make very similar points but I have been on the couch with a hangover all day.  Not conducive for writing wordy replies. 

Ban whisky imo.

[Marky147]

Moving off in tangents but education is certainly key to stopping kids becoming addicted to these machines. I am all for what Martin Lewis has been trying to do, it just makes so much sense on many levels. 

I'd also say that Arbboy has pretty much nailed it throughout this thread with his take on it.  I wanted to make very similar points but I have been on the couch with a hangover all day.  Not conducive for writing wordy replies. 

Ban whisky imo.