The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

EU Brexit ambos warned UK can't be trusted with sensitive data - latest round in brewing data war with Brussels

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/04/21/eu-warns-uk-cannot-trusted-sensitive-data-hopes-fade-future/

[RickBFA]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/project-fears-brexit-predictions-were-wrong-by-%c2%a3100-billion-new-report-says/ar-AAwbTH3?ocid=spartanntp

Bit of other news on Brexit to balance the debate...

[Woodsey]

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/project-fears-brexit-predictions-were-wrong-by-%c2%a3100-billion-new-report-says/ar-AAwbTH3?ocid=spartanntp

Bit of other news on Brexit to balance the debate...

Fake news it’s all doom and gloom....

[rfgqqabc]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

[rfgqqabc]

It also detracts from the more important question regarding the referendum and side taking. I think I agree that the Treasury should not be releasing reports that go one way or another but then we are left with this situation where Media rags run headlines before the "report" is even released publicly.

[RickBFA]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

[Woodsey]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

Stop upsetting the rewhiners, you should know you’re not allowed to disagree with them.....

[Doobs]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

I think most agree that Osborne's very precise estimates were comical.  But this is comical too.  The fella has been beating the same tune for years and is a prominent UKIPer.  He was one of the most extreme monetarist advisors to Thatcher back in the day.

Anyway, enough on him, nobody can say how wrong the forecasts were, as Brexit hasn't happened.  Even afterwards, we will never know, because there is no Brexit free UK to act as a comparison. 

We can say that the UK was growing faster than the Eurozone before the Brexit vote and now isn't, but nobody has any idea why that is.  It could be just different stages of the cycle or could be Brexit, or a combination, or could be something completely different.   Similarly, it is clear the NHS is suffering, but public sector funding was getting heavily restricted before Brexit.

Basically who knows? Osborne didn't know the precise cost and  Congdon doesn't know either.

[RickBFA]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

I think most agree that Osborne's very precise estimates were comical.  But this is comical too.  The fella has been beating the same tune for years and is a prominent UKIPer.  He was one of the most extreme monetarist advisors to Thatcher back in the day.

Anyway, enough on him, nobody can say how wrong the forecasts were, as Brexit hasn't happened.  Even afterwards, we will never know, because there is no Brexit free UK to act as a comparison. 

We can say that the UK was growing faster than the Eurozone before the Brexit vote and now isn't, but nobody has any idea why that is.  It could be just different stages of the cycle or could be Brexit, or a combination, or could be something completely different.   Similarly, it is clear the NHS is suffering, but public sector funding was getting heavily restricted before Brexit.

Basically who knows? Osborne didn't know the precise cost and  Congdon doesn't know either.

Not unreasonable, hard to disagree with a lot of that. So no one knows what’s going to happen.

As long as all opinions and views (rather than actual facts) are greeted with the same scepticism i’d be happy.

Problem is though views from the likes of the Guardian and alot of the political elite, that still won’t accept what’s happened (Blair, Clegg, Major, spring to mind) are treated as if they are somehow accepted wisdom.

[rfgqqabc]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

It is not an article on that. There is next to no information on a report that hasn't even been published yet.

Also, why do I have to impartially post? I typically try not to post very much here because I do not think people particularly care about my opinion so when I post it tends to be because something bothers me. The most laughable part of this post is that only I replied, then you respond and Woodsey jumps in with a snarky 0 input remark that stinks of bandwagoning. Where are the hoards of remainers jumping in? I actually feel like this forum is reasonably split but obviously Remain get a boost in posts because Tighty is trying to generate posts, and I believe supports Remain.

If you don't see the problem with multiple streams of media publishing the bare bones headline from a report that isn't even publicly released yet, whilst criticizing the exact same thing on the behalf of Remainers then what is the point of this discussion? Do I need to come up with some sort of fancy project name? Project Drear?

[RickBFA]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

It is not an article on that. There is next to no information on a report that hasn't even been published yet.

Also, why do I have to impartially post? I typically try not to post very much here because I do not think people particularly care about my opinion so when I post it tends to be because something bothers me. The most laughable part of this post is that only I replied, then you respond and Woodsey jumps in with a snarky 0 input remark that stinks of bandwagoning. Where are the hoards of remainers jumping in? I actually feel like this forum is reasonably split but obviously Remain get a boost in posts because Tighty is trying to generate posts, and I believe supports Remain.

If you don't see the problem with multiple streams of media publishing the bare bones headline from a report that isn't even publicly released yet, whilst criticizing the exact same thing on the behalf of Remainers then what is the point of this discussion? Do I need to come up with some sort of fancy project name? Project Drear?

I wasn’t referring to you specifically, even though it may have come across that way - I was referring to what will have been dozens of press/online  opinions posted on Brexit here that are just opinions which are rarely criticised - even though, as Doobs has much more elequently said, no one knows.

Nothing wrong with other articles on the subject being posted here, even if they are viewed as laughable by the resident sage’s.

[nirvana]

UKIP candidate economist in Brexit not that bad shocker. Extremely boring to debate economics/results of the decision before it has even happened!

Why don't they include the name of the report? Oh right, because the "report" is actually an article in the May edition of Standpoint.

I do chuckle when one article that is posted on here that criticises the remain campaign/forecasts when literally dozens of articles/opinions/Guardian pieces that are pro remain get posted without a word.

What is wrong with posting a different view on here compared to the endless views that push a pro EU perspective?

The credibility of what the likes of Osborne/BOE said is in tatters. Their tactics were a disgrace and cost remain the vote. An article on that isn’t worthy of a place in a political thread?

It is not an article on that. There is next to no information on a report that hasn't even been published yet.

Also, why do I have to impartially post? I typically try not to post very much here because I do not think people particularly care about my opinion so when I post it tends to be because something bothers me. The most laughable part of this post is that only I replied, then you respond and Woodsey jumps in with a snarky 0 input remark that stinks of bandwagoning. Where are the hoards of remainers jumping in? I actually feel like this forum is reasonably split but obviously Remain get a boost in posts because Tighty is trying to generate posts, and I believe supports Remain.

If you don't see the problem with multiple streams of media publishing the bare bones headline from a report that isn't even publicly released yet, whilst criticizing the exact same thing on the behalf of Remainers then what is the point of this discussion? Do I need to come up with some sort of fancy project name? Project Drear?

You should post more..always intelligent I think whether I agree or not

[TightEnd]

Japan ambassador’s Brexit warning: there won’t be a deal better than the single market


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/22/koji-tsuruoka-japan-ambassador-britain-brexit-single-market?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

[4KSuited]

Japan ambassador’s Brexit warning: there won’t be a deal better than the single market


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/22/koji-tsuruoka-japan-ambassador-britain-brexit-single-market?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

There's no new news there either.

It's like your parents saying "I told you it wouldn't work out" every day for nearly 2 years when they think you've made the wrong decision - the one where you decide you want to have a shot at being a professional sportsperson.... then you break your leg and you're now a couple of years behind your peers. Maybe the analogy isn't the best (I'm tired), but these articles in the Islington Champagne Lefty broadsheets are just further examples of the "listen to us experts, you don't know what you're doing" Remain Campaign variety. No?

[kukushkin88]

Japan ambassador’s Brexit warning: there won’t be a deal better than the single market


https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/apr/22/koji-tsuruoka-japan-ambassador-britain-brexit-single-market?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

There's no new news there either.

It's like your parents saying "I told you it wouldn't work out" every day for nearly 2 years when they think you've made the wrong decision - the one where you decide you want to have a shot at being a professional sportsperson.... then you break your leg and you're now a couple of years behind your peers. Maybe the analogy isn't the best (I'm tired), but these articles in the Islington Champagne Lefty broadsheets are just further examples of the "listen to us experts, you don't know what you're doing" Remain Campaign variety. No?

If not the ambassador of a key potential trading partner, a man who has a wealth of experience negotiating trade deals......Then who should we be listening to? Are you aware that even Gove has backtracked hard on the whole "we've had enough of experts" narrative? Seriously, if not experts, then who?