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Author Topic: Barred from Grosvenor Casinos  (Read 23650 times)
AceGing
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« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2018, 03:14:06 PM »

Why did the security guard look in your bag after you had gone?

Was just gonna say this, seems pretty irregular

The answer to this is I'm not sure. Everyone who I have told this to has said, the security guard isn't allowed/can't do that - but I can't really argue because at the end of the day, he found those cards. If he found nothing, then I would never know my bag was searched, but when I went downstairs and was presented with my bag - the cards struck my mind - even without saying a word I knew that my bag had been searched while I was upstairs in the card room.

As I said, the cards were in a completely separate compartment to my wallet. I got my bank card out of my wallet and went back upstairs - for some reason he may have thought this was suspicious?

That's very strange, pretty sure he's not allowed to do that but don't know for sure. Best of luck with getting un-banned, seems like an insane situation.

I agree that if he thought something was suspicious, then he could have notified me there and then. I certainly was not behaving in a shady manner, after all I had forgotten I'd left the cards in there.

Whatever he thought he saw - when he went looking, he hit the jackpot and thunderball all in one..
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Rexas
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« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2018, 03:35:19 PM »

Why did the security guard look in your bag after you had gone?

Was just gonna say this, seems pretty irregular

The answer to this is I'm not sure. Everyone who I have told this to has said, the security guard isn't allowed/can't do that - but I can't really argue because at the end of the day, he found those cards. If he found nothing, then I would never know my bag was searched, but when I went downstairs and was presented with my bag - the cards struck my mind - even without saying a word I knew that my bag had been searched while I was upstairs in the card room.

As I said, the cards were in a completely separate compartment to my wallet. I got my bank card out of my wallet and went back upstairs - for some reason he may have thought this was suspicious?

That's very strange, pretty sure he's not allowed to do that but don't know for sure. Best of luck with getting un-banned, seems like an insane situation.

I agree that if he thought something was suspicious, then he could have notified me there and then. I certainly was not behaving in a shady manner, after all I had forgotten I'd left the cards in there.

Whatever he thought he saw - when he went looking, he hit the jackpot and thunderball all in one..

I'm not sure that having an old deck of cards in your backpack is really that bad, if they were in your pocket it's a whole different story. If they're an old deck you can't have nicked them on the day or had any use out of them, all very strange.

Would say to avoid telling anyone your friends name who gave you the cards if he still works there, imagine that could get him in trouble.
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« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2018, 03:38:27 PM »

I'd definitely be asking the question why the security guard searched your bag. I don't know the rules but I would guess that if they had suspicions about your bag that they should have called you down and asked you to open it for them. They could have put anything in there and framed you for it.
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« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2018, 03:41:57 PM »


a) Security guard should have been sacked.

b) I can see why they have barred you.  From their POV, you have access to their branded cards which is a huge security risk.
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Simon Galloway
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« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2018, 04:01:19 PM »

 Casino definitely should have made more of an effort extracting from you the source of the cards. It really is in their best interests to identify that leak and fix it.

That clearly wouldn't be a good thing for your friend if he is still in the biz. I don't really see a happy ending for anyone in this, at best you get re-instated and your friend gets a visit from security and at worst you both get lifetime bans.

Whilst there was no intent, I think you are just going to have to suck this one up as going into a casino with an unmarked deck of theirs just isn't a good thing to do.


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tikay
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« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2018, 04:03:59 PM »

I just want to confirm what the OP said earlier today.

He is a player Next Door with several thousand games to his credit, & he posts from time to time on the Forum there.

He sent me the narrative yesterday, hoping I may know someone, or know someone who does, & I first suggested he post the whole story, & them we can go from there. I believe he had done that on 2+2 a while back, &, of course, 2+2 being what it is, he got savaged by the trolls. I assured him that, for the most part, the blondes are not like that.  

He goes by the name of "Ging", (pronounced with a hard G as in "King"), & seems a very genuine guy to me. I believe he is a British born chap of Chinese descent.  

Grosvenor are playing hardball here - he struggles to even talk to them or get a non-generic reply. Grosvenor, of course, may consider they have good reasons.  

I used to have a few high level contacts in Grosvenor, we did a bit of business back in my APAT days, so I'll have to have a look & see if they are still in place.

If any blondes have any worthwhile contacts, I'm sure Ging would appreciate your help.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 04:17:08 PM by tikay » Logged

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tikay
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« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2018, 04:11:05 PM »



Anyone know if Russell Tamplin is still at Grosvenor?
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AceGing
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« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2018, 04:12:19 PM »

Casino definitely should have made more of an effort extracting from you the source of the cards. It really is in their best interests to identify that leak and fix it.

That clearly wouldn't be a good thing for your friend if he is still in the biz. I don't really see a happy ending for anyone in this, at best you get re-instated and your friend gets a visit from security and at worst you both get lifetime bans.

Whilst there was no intent, I think you are just going to have to suck this one up as going into a casino with an unmarked deck of theirs just isn't a good thing to do.




Ok to divulge a little

The poker dealer is just someone I know who happened to also be a student at our uni and a poker dealer. He no longer works at Grosvenor or in the casino business and have not had any contact with them since long before this incident occurred

This same person actually tried to "sell/swap" cash chips with me - and said they wouldn't rake my pots in the cash games. I wasn't comfortable and definitely not ok with this. I went and told the card room manager, and they subsequently were let go from employment. They had tried to get several people to take up this deal, so  they do not know I am part of the reason they lost their job (I was assured by the CRM that he wouldn't have my name mentioned...

This is also the reason that the card room manager of that casino is willing to vouch for me - I've helped him in the past and he knows that I'm an honest person and cheating myself would never cross my mind.

Preparing for the backlash for being a grass etc. now...
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 04:17:32 PM by AceGing » Logged
tikay
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« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2018, 04:18:19 PM »

Casino definitely should have made more of an effort extracting from you the source of the cards. It really is in their best interests to identify that leak and fix it.

That clearly wouldn't be a good thing for your friend if he is still in the biz. I don't really see a happy ending for anyone in this, at best you get re-instated and your friend gets a visit from security and at worst you both get lifetime bans.

Whilst there was no intent, I think you are just going to have to suck this one up as going into a casino with an unmarked deck of theirs just isn't a good thing to do.




Ok to divulge a little

The poker dealer is just someone I know who happened to also be a student at our uni and a poker dealer. He no longer works at Grosvenor or in the casino business and have not had any contact with them since long before this incident occurred

This same person actually tried to "sell/swap" cash chips with me - and said they wouldn't rake my pots in the cash games. I went and told the card room manager, and they subsequently were let go from employment. They had tried to get several people to take up this deal, so  they do not know I am part of the reason they lost their job (I was assured by the CRM that he wouldn't have my name mentioned...

This is also the reason that the card room manager of that casino is willing to vouch for me - I've helped him in the past and he knows that I'm an honest person and cheating myself would never cross my mind.

Preparing for the backlash for being a grass etc. now...

I hope not.

It may in fact well have some relevance here.
 
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Longines
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« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2018, 04:23:19 PM »



Anyone know if Russell Tamplin is still at Grosvenor?

Appears so if his LinkedIn is up-to-date.
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AceGing
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« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2018, 04:55:45 PM »

I just want to confirm what the OP said earlier today.

He is a player Next Door with several thousand games to his credit, & he posts from time to time on the Forum there.

He sent me the narrative yesterday, hoping I may know someone, or know someone who does, & I first suggested he post the whole story, & them we can go from there. I believe he had done that on 2+2 a while back, &, of course, 2+2 being what it is, he got savaged by the trolls. I assured him that, for the most part, the blondes are not like that.  

He goes by the name of "Ging", (pronounced with a hard G as in "King"), & seems a very genuine guy to me. I believe he is a British born chap of Chinese descent.  

Grosvenor are playing hardball here - he struggles to even talk to them or get a non-generic reply. Grosvenor, of course, may consider they have good reasons.  

I used to have a few high level contacts in Grosvenor, we did a bit of business back in my APAT days, so I'll have to have a look & see if they are still in place.

If any blondes have any worthwhile contacts, I'm sure Ging would appreciate your help.


Anyone know if Russell Tamplin is still at Grosvenor?

Thanks for your replay Tikay, without your input I would have just left this thread as it is very disheartening to fight for what seems is a lost cause as I've been barred for 3 years now.

To maybe add a little to the discussion..

Grosvenor told me their reinstatement/security team would conduct a full investigation before giving me the decision to uphold or reinstate my membership

- If they checked the cameras, however far back they keep records - they would never have seen anything suspicious because I was just playing poker just like any other person.
- Automatic card shufflers - They have at least one machine shuffler for the cash games which detects if there's any missing cards - so if there was a scenario where I was cheating - card switching or whatever, what am I supposed to do, switch cards mid hand, then after I show down or win the pot,  switch cards again before the cards go back to the card shuffler?
- Deck design - I'm not 100% on this but I think I had a red deck with the mini cross-hatched design, which were replaced by a "swirly" design. So obviously the cards were discontinued and not in use
- Full deck of 52 cards in the bag, none on the gaming floor or on me in person - surely they would have at least counted the deck before discarding them?
- I'm sure others have seen this as well - Occasionally the dealers go on an empty table and count the decks, then sign them in/out or whatever on a clip board. So there is a record to make sure none go missing. If Bournemouth performed an audit and saw none were missing, they certainly didn't come asking for where they originated from..

This would probably take all of 15 minutes to explain if I could have arranged a meeting with the managers at Bournemouth  but it seems like they won't entertain the idea of it.

Besides the security guard issue, do all of the above seem reasonable arguements for me to put across?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 05:03:48 PM by AceGing » Logged
doubleup
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« Reply #26 on: January 30, 2018, 05:48:29 PM »


If the style of cards were completely out of use and had been for some time before the incident, you can make the case that they couldn't have been used at all for any nefarious purpose. 

But if the same style were in use anywhere, it is a really bad security lapse for them.  The cards left the casino and could have been tampered with and then re-introduced to the casino.  So that is not good and I can see why they barred you.
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ripple11
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« Reply #27 on: January 30, 2018, 06:24:01 PM »

I tried to help a friend who was also banned from Grosvenor (The Vic). He was a long standing member but wasn't given a reason and couldn't think why. The reinstatement@rank.com never replied even after several attempts over several months.
However after about a year, he tried going into another Grosvenor and he suddenly found the ban was lifted.
Have you tried going in to the casino and asking them if the ban is still current?
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AceGing
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« Reply #28 on: January 30, 2018, 06:26:03 PM »

I tried to help a friend who was also banned from Grosvenor (The Vic). He was a long standing member but wasn't given a reason and couldn't think why. The reinstatement@rank.com never replied even after several attempts over several months.
However after about a year, he tried going into another Grosvenor and he suddenly found the ban was lifted.
Have you tried going in to the casino and asking them if the ban is still current?

Yes, very recently I went in to try and get the ban lifted and it was a no, apparently the question was asked to all of the managers but who knows if it gets that far..

This is a group wide ban which has extended to Gentings as well (I'm guessing I've been ban-hammered  and placed on a ban list shared between the two companies..).

« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 06:32:42 PM by AceGing » Logged
AceGing
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« Reply #29 on: January 30, 2018, 06:30:58 PM »


If the style of cards were completely out of use and had been for some time before the incident, you can make the case that they couldn't have been used at all for any nefarious purpose. 

But if the same style were in use anywhere, it is a really bad security lapse for them.  The cards left the casino and could have been tampered with and then re-introduced to the casino.  So that is not good and I can see why they barred you.


Thanks for the reply doubleup. I agree a ban of some sorts was not unexpected. 6 months, a year or whatever. I accept that I made a huge mistake. What gets me is that they said they'd conduct an investigation, yet they don't disclose any information on their findings (outside of this incident I had never had any trouble) or even contact me to try and clear up the grey areas or any questions marks there could be.

AFAIK Grosvenor keep a track of which casino I've been in, because you are always asked to sign in at reception.
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