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Beaulieu motor museum -  https://www.beaulieu.co.uk/attractions/national-motor-museum/

Amberley museum - http://www.amberleymuseum.co.uk/

[liverpool are in a state now.]

liverpool are in a state now.

a few years back they could get players into the club just because people wanted to play for liverpool - even being out of the champions league wasnt insurmountable tp bringing in talent.

now they are a cup side. and a selling club. not long now before you can say it is 30 years since a league title and 1 european cup victory in 35 years. to put that into context when liverpool last won the league you could have said it was 30 years since burnley had last won the league.

take coutinho, when he was twelve chelsea were just starting to dominate the premier league. liverpool havent won the league in his liifetime. soon there will be players playing whose parents wont be able to remember when liverpool last won the league. their best players over the last few years have been: mascherano, gerrard, alonso, torres, sturridge, sterling, suarez and coutinho. all except gerrard and sturridge left for bigger clubs. and even mr liverpoool steve gerrard was as close as it gets to leaving for chelsea.  if sturridge had been fully fit with 25+ goals a season he'd likely be elsewhere. now coutinho is going. there's not much a mid-tier cup fixated selling club can do to keep genuine talent. they are to man city, chelsea, barca etc what southampton are to liverpool.

its a new era for the young generations. liverpool arent seen as a domestic powerhouse, much less a big club internationally.

They've always got their istry to fall back on.

So much istry.

Nice troll post, must of been following the Stoke thread recently 

Only fans who you ever hear going on about history is fans of teams other than Liverpool

City have just bought a title, other than that only thing I ever remember of them is relegating United.
In terms of Europe, Manure, Chelsea and Arsenal have been fucking awful considering many times they been in Champions league.

As for players being sold Suarez and Coutinho wanted the moves, everyone knows South American players want to be at Barca/Real and nothing is stopping that.
Mascherano was nowhere near the best player, Torres was fucking awful by the time Liverpool sold him and got a ridic fee way above his value.
Sterling was over-rated and hasn't been missed at all.
Alonso was a massive fucking loss, but was caused by Benitez being a shit man manager

Logically you would expect business to be cost cutting, battening down the hatches if an economic disaster is round the corner?

Seems to me like they have been?

Watering down of employment terms to zero hours and short term contracts seems like a handy way to insulate your balance sheet from a demand side shock

This might be 180 degrees out, zero hours, poor employment terms (especially in respect of termination) and short term contracts are not a response to us potentially leaving, they are more solidly a consequence of free movement of labour within  the EU (especially since enlargement).

Absolutely. I wasn't equating the referendum result with the rise in poor terms of employment.  The problem long pre-dates that and does seem to pretty strongly indicate an excess in the supply of labour.

The economic argument for freedom of movement in terms of UK living standards does seem to me to be somewhat weak. I actually find the arguments that the economic benefits accrue almost entirely to (a) the capitalist employer and (b) the migrant worker leaving very little to trickle down into the wider economy to be very persuasive. I'm on the fence at this point as to whether soft brexit > remain for overall living standards.

This customs union stuff does all seem pretty unnecessary though. Another doubting voice but an entertaining read I thought:

http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2017/08/15/the-government-s-customs-union-plan-is-an-absolute-dog-s-bre

Contrary to the leavers' calls to cut EU rules and regulations we seem to be aiming to repatriate and expand customs bureaucracy. Pouring hundreds of millions of pounds of public money into creating unnecessary government jobs? Sounds almost.....socialist!   

 

Aah yes, mis-read your initial post completely.

On your other point about costs and the time and effort to replace what we already have - in a vacuum it seems bonkers and I occasionally waver and question the way I voted.

But then I feel bad for all the countries that aren't allowed in the EU and feel we should leave in solidarity with them rather than the EU states.

Surely he can't go on like this for a full term..... Can he?

Was thinking about this a lot last night. Assuming no direct scandal/impeachment/resignation/assassination, there is no way at all he can be fired just for being really really shit is there?

He is 4-1 to go in 2018 with a few bookies, I quite like those odds.

In February I stuck £350 on him exiting 2017 at 9/2, seemed a great price to me but I can't see it happening in such a short time from now.

Apparently Stoke are paying Chelsea £8m for the season long Zouma loan.

With wages or with wages on top?  With wages that would seem a reasonable one year rental price wise to me given his quality.

I don't know. I'd guess wages are paid by Stoke but maybe that's included in the £8m. What would he be on, £40K, so £2m/year? So Stoke are paying £8m or maybe £10m total?
Bayern are paying Real Madrid €5m/year loan fee for James Rodriguez. Do you think that's a reasonable rental price?

West Ham paid £4.5m to take Hart on loan for the season, but City are subsidising his wages so in realty we only get about £2m.

If that Zouma figure is correct, I'm pretty sure that includes his wages too.

He will be on more than £40k a week as well at Chelski surely?  So if he is on £70k a week and Stoke are paying it all then his 'rental' is £4.5m for the season providing your figures are correct.

You think Kurt Zouma is on £70K a week? A bit of googling suggested to me it was £40K but it seems he's just signed a new 6 year deal so probably higher than that. 70K seems a bit steep though.
But okay, let's go with that. So the rental fee is about the same as Bayern are paying for James then?

He will be on £200k a week though.  You have to tell the whole story.  How much of that salary are BM paying that RM don't have to?  

But wait!
You're saying the £8m fee Stoke are paying must cover Zoumas wages but the fee Bayern pays doesn't? Okay.
But even still, you are the one who decided to discount Zoumas (inflated imo) wages from the loan to arrive at a rental figure of £4.5m. Which, accounting for currency rates, is the same fee Bayern are paying Real for James.
Are you having your cake and eating it too?

Each loan deal is totally different and unique.  I have no idea on the figures.  Other people have plucked these figures from wherever.  The BM deal might be £5m a year plus BM have to pay his wages in full therefore costing probably £15m in total for a one year rental.  I have no idea what the deal is.  Neither do you i would suggest.  Zouma on £70k a week isn't expensive for a centre half of his quality in 2017.  Shawcross is on similar to that and he signed his deal years ago for Stoke.  How many proper first team squad members (that haven't come through the ranks) are on less than £50k a week at Chelski?  They have youth team guys locked up on monster salaries who have never played for the first team.

Well the Spanish paper Marca say that James earns €8m/year, rising to €8.2m next year. If correct and we take your stance that Bayern will pay the entirity of his wages and Zouma's wages are covered by the loan fee, then we arrive at;
James Rodriguez €13m = £11.9m/year.
Kurt Zouma = £8m/year.
That's the best case scenario.
If Stoke have to pay some of Zouma's wages on top and/or Real are subsidising James, then maybe Zouma is actually more expensive than James!
No wonder WBA baulked at the £8m fee and left him to the smaller club, Stoke

Joking aside, I like Zouma but I don't think he's the finished article yet, hence why he's out on loan rather than in the desperately short of numbers Chelsea squad.
That's an expensive deal for Stoke, no matter what way you slice it, they are paying £160k/week for someone with potential with no asset at the end of it.

Logically you would expect business to be cost cutting, battening down the hatches if an economic disaster is round the corner?

Seems to me like they have been?

Watering down of employment terms to zero hours and short term contracts seems like a handy way to insulate your balance sheet from a demand side shock

This might be 180 degrees out, zero hours, poor employment terms (especially in respect of termination) and short term contracts are not a response to us potentially leaving, they are more solidly a consequence of free movement of labour within  the EU (especially since enlargement).

Absolutely. I wasn't equating the referendum result with the rise in poor terms of employment.  The problem long pre-dates that and does seem to pretty strongly indicate an excess in the supply of labour.

The economic argument for freedom of movement in terms of UK living standards does seem to me to be somewhat weak. I actually find the arguments that the economic benefits accrue almost entirely to (a) the capitalist employer and (b) the migrant worker leaving very little to trickle down into the wider economy to be very persuasive. I'm on the fence at this point as to whether soft brexit > remain for overall living standards.

This customs union stuff does all seem pretty unnecessary though. Another doubting voice but an entertaining read I thought:

http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2017/08/15/the-government-s-customs-union-plan-is-an-absolute-dog-s-bre

Contrary to the leavers' calls to cut EU rules and regulations we seem to be aiming to repatriate and expand customs bureaucracy. Pouring hundreds of millions of pounds of public money into creating unnecessary government jobs? Sounds almost.....socialist!   



 

Duberry made me rofl - classic Nirvana.

Schmeichel

G Neville
Stam
Ferdinand
Le Saux

Ronaldo
Keane
Scholes
Overmars

Suarez
Van Nistelrooy

*swoons*

No fucking around in that team.

A proper premiership side, pure intent throughout.

Started re watching from the first season, highly recommend for those that dont study YouTube and Thrones Wiki, so many ah ha moments and ohh that's who she/he is. Makes the new season so much more enjoyable.

Still not sure who's worst though, Joffery or Boulton. Some scenes I'd completely forgotten about and with good reason.

Ramsey surely? Joffrey more smackable though

Yeah, have to agree, Joffery is so smug. Just haven't reached the Ramsey stuff yet so not as fresh in the minds eye, thank goodness.

Decent quality if u don't want to wait....

http://solarmoviefree.net/watch/game-of-thrones-s07-2011-online-free-solarmovie.html