Issues Arising from Staking

[smashedagain]

Still haven't seen anyone post a legit reason not to use the template. Just because someone can't be bothered to take the time to pen a proper proposal doesn't really count in my eyes.

Some of us might not want our sharkscope and OPR plastering all over here to give the haters any ammunition

[millidonk]

Still haven't seen anyone post a legit reason not to use the template. Just because someone can't be bothered to take the time to pen a proper proposal doesn't really count in my eyes.

Don't think you can make people do it mate, it should just be a suggested guideline rather than a must do imo.

It would be incredibly easy to make people do it, but I imagine there are a few liberals out there who would kick up a fuss.

I don't think just because someone can't be bothered/doesn't want to take the time to pen a decent proposal counts towards a decent reason not to use a template nor do I think just asking for the information after the thread has gone up if you are inclined to know is the perfect solution. Surely having all the information upfront as standard would be happy days for everyone. I don't think the person's profile or how well they are liked should come into it at all. Make it a level playing field and complete transparency ftw.

Herbs, obv if you have a shit OPR/Sharkscope then you will just have to sell on personality. GL with that. 

[smashedagain]

Still haven't seen anyone post a legit reason not to use the template. Just because someone can't be bothered to take the time to pen a proper proposal doesn't really count in my eyes.

Don't think you can make people do it mate, it should just be a suggested guideline rather than a must do imo.

It would be incredibly easy to make people do it, but I imagine there are a few liberals out there who would kick up a fuss.

I don't think just because someone can't be bothered/doesn't want to take the time to pen a decent proposal counts towards a decent reason not to use a template nor do I think just asking for the information after the thread has gone up if you are inclined to know is the perfect solution. Surely having all the information upfront as standard would be happy days for everyone. I don't think the person's profile or how well they are liked should come into it at all. Make it a level playing field and complete transparency ftw.

Herbs, obv if you have a shit OPR/Sharkscope then you will just have to sell on personality. GL with that. 

Yeah already been told by pm that I used to be one of the most popular posters on here and now you are just a wanker. Wish I could just post half the pm's I've got on here would be the best diary by far.
They love it when someone else is getting it but when the tables are turned on them they get the hump.

[Doobs]

Simon, as there are some market factors at work beyond simply "value"

Would you interfere with this process (can you interfere with it), in terms of price setting, or merely wait for the factors to disssipate and equilibrium prices move towards something more realistically equating to EV?

How about making links to tracking sites a part of the template and a requirement for posting a thread? It'd be pretty hard to ask for .5 markup with an opr that says -9%, even casual punters will see that something is up. It'd also save me asking for them and getting brutally flamed the times when I don't.

Also, the prices would reach an equilibrium much more quickly if there were some downward pressure, for example if someone thinks a price is out of whack and a hugely -EV proposition, they could undercut the seller, e.g. "you could have 1% of Alex's Columbia LAPT winnings with me at 1.5", then that would create extra supply, reducing the price, as well as sending a pretty strong signal that some people believe the price is getting out of line. Of course, that would require people to actually back up their opinions rather than just shouting about them so I can't see it happening any time soon.

Will lay up to 2.5% at 1.5

[dan]

I still don't see the problem... The staking boards have been used for years without too much hassle...it only seems to have become a problem lately because some people decide to go on people's threads just to have a pop..

The argument for auctions is that people are paying over the odds, then people reply with things like the market decides the price.. Well surely that is the same if someone puts up a bad proposal...if people wanna buy they will.

 Yeah say something if you know the guy was backed in for a £1k comp then fucked off without playing it but why go on a thread and say 1.2,1.4 or whatever is bad value..just cuz you think it's bad someone else might want a punt or whatever...I bet these same people don't stand outside hills and tell people not to back trap 2 in the 11-07 at Crayford cuz it should be 5-1 not 7-2

Pleno's recent op in a staking thread is one of the best I've seen.. Matt's requests, by his own words, have been more I wanna play..who wants a piece lets have fun..

They both sell out because "the market decides" if the market decided that Matt's proposal isn't good then they don't buy..but they do cuz he is well known and has friends on here and he might be a decent player too

It seems that the staking board is the only place on blonde that people are allowed to flame so much so that at the bottom of a lot of OPs people write flame away...

Anyway enough said, flame away

[Simon Galloway]

Figured I'd dredge this one up... have talked to various people recently that are habitual stakers to see how their views/outlook are changing this time around.

How about the casual punters out there?  Is the reluctance to pay hefty markup increasing?  If so, is it due to principle, adjusted views on fair value, being under it, having had bad previous experiences or something else?

More and more people have posted that they have hit their WSOP budget for staking.  First year I have noticed anyone say that.. is that due to previous losses, or noticing you over-staked previously, or something else?

[George2Loose]

Yawn

[Simon Galloway]

Lol, planning a staking thread or something?

[tight4better]

Yawn

[SuuPRlim]

mark-ups have gotten ridic imo, but people happy to pay so there is no issue.

People assume i) They can approximate the value of a tournament on hearsay and guesswork, and ii) they are assuming that they will be feeling great and playing their A-Game 100% of the time.

People who've never played the main event before but have heard it's just 6 days of taking chips of farmers are grossly mis-lead, I had two of the toughest tables i've played on in the ME last year, and if you look at the last 40 players (where the big money jumps come) over the last two years the fields have been very very strong.

I've pretty much quit buying pieces cos I'm down so much money in the last 2 yrs staking theres no way out of it lol

[RED-DOG]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-ptolAoDziT0/T4kNpqJ2C5I/AAAAAAAABBA/D42Er6CMJRA/s1600/it%27s+been+done+gf.jpg

[millidonk]

Figured I'd dredge this one up... have talked to various people recently that are habitual stakers to see how their views/outlook are changing this time around.

How about the casual punters out there?  Is the reluctance to pay hefty markup increasing?  If so, is it due to principle, adjusted views on fair value, being under it, having had bad previous experiences or something else?

More and more people have posted that they have hit their WSOP budget for staking.  First year I have noticed anyone say that.. is that due to previous losses, or noticing you over-staked previously, or something else?

I would have classed myself as a prolific punter on the staking boards last couple of years, it was rare I passed up on an opportunity, but have taken a significant step back recently. I think it's a combination of your bolded parts. Missus going back to work and having to stump up for childcare had the biggest impact on me personally, last year I lost like £2k taking small pieces of people in the WSOP so said I would just swerve this year and look for slightly lower variance options.

One thing that you haven't mentioned, which from speaking to a couple of others on the forum I know to be true, is that there are some people who only ever seem to take from the staking boards without ever really giving back. I.e put up requests but you never see them take a piece of anyone else. Fair enough if you are under it or whatever but when you are not I think it's only fair to give a little back. It's probably a debate in itself really; "Should people feel obliged to buy pieces of others just because they sell their own action?" I think they should else you are just taking money out of the community. Lion King that shit, circle of life..

Echo lild's comments. 1.5 is a joke price for most people. Not all, but certainly the vast majority. That said, if i was selling at 1.5 I wouldn't feel inclined to drop it down just because some people thought it was too high for them to buy.

[Simon Galloway]

Surprised at you tbh Tom.

@ L'il Dave, I agree with you that people often mention the thousand weak players in the field, but that still leaves them with a couple of thousand decent ones to negotiate.  I also agree that Vegas is a hard place to bank on to produce your A game, but those subjects have been 'done to death' - views are formed and won't change from one year to the next.

@ Big Dave, the whole community spirit thing I think some people factor in and some clearly don't - so there will be heated differences of opinion coming to the surface on that from time to time.

It is something that will continue to evolve over time and I will keep an eye on ~ either to increase or decrease my own activity ~ as enough of a sample size materialises to give results that support views on value.

[RED-DOG]

Surprised at you tbh Tom.

Why are you surprised Mr G? I thought it was fair comment tbh.

And why a new thread instead of using one of the many other threads on this subject? (Not that I mind in the least of course)

For the record, I wasn't having a pop. you are one of the most astute posters on the forum imo, and I value your opinions above most others.

[Woodsey]

Figured I'd dredge this one up... have talked to various people recently that are habitual stakers to see how their views/outlook are changing this time around.

How about the casual punters out there?  Is the reluctance to pay hefty markup increasing?  If so, is it due to principle, adjusted views on fair value, being under it, having had bad previous experiences or something else?

More and more people have posted that they have hit their WSOP budget for staking.  First year I have noticed anyone say that.. is that due to previous losses, or noticing you over-staked previously, or something else?

Said this the other week but as you've brought it up again, I used to stake all the time but won't pay anything but a minimal mark up out of principal now. My view is we are doing the stakees a favour not the other way around.....

Having said that is got pissed the other night and put a bid in on something would never otherwise have done, maybe that's the trick, catch me when I'm pissed