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Author Topic: whats my stack worth?  (Read 5892 times)
Doobs
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« Reply #15 on: May 13, 2013, 03:44:11 AM »

ye....know what u mean.... its a real tricky one.....got another bullet or two but the fear is I don't get through again!!!

 had a shoe opportunity on my very last hand which was the BB to a min raise UTG.  as I watched the short stack go out on another table I got timed out! a successful shove would put me on over 30k. gutted!!

It can't be that tricky?  If you play another day 1 you are burning a grand or so of equity.   
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dik9
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« Reply #16 on: May 13, 2013, 06:59:24 AM »

I am confused a little (nothing knew) but can you sell a day 2 seat? Surely you can't transfer players half way through a tourney?
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redsimon
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« Reply #17 on: May 13, 2013, 07:21:49 AM »

you got a healthy stack..... think if you sell some action it should be based on the 3k euro ticket myself.

I got a tough decision - just made it through the online with 21k stack, not sure if this is any good to take to Wembley or should I try my other bullets?Huh? tricky one as I might not get through with other goes?Huh??
If you have other Day 1 tokens won thru' sats etc then you would need to factor in that by not giving up stack you get x times 300 euros for unused Day 1 tokens?
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YEAHMAN123
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« Reply #18 on: May 13, 2013, 07:41:54 AM »

you got a healthy stack..... think if you sell some action it should be based on the 3k euro ticket myself.

I got a tough decision - just made it through the online with 21k stack, not sure if this is any good to take to Wembley or should I try my other bullets?Huh? tricky one as I might not get through with other goes?Huh??

was you shoving everyhand at the end?
if i had 3x + day1 seats available to myself then insted of cashing them id have another go myself
keep reading that 20k is playable but do you really want to go to london a short stack? alot of players on here would not
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Vinodh
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« Reply #19 on: May 13, 2013, 09:00:59 AM »

Ross, I would still say 20k is not a short stack at all with the blinds starting at 100/200 ( which is similar to any deepstacks that we usually play at DTD), ofcourse the cost of travel accommodation and any other logistics needed to be looked at.. But the opportunity like this dont come often... YEAHMAN!!!
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« Reply #20 on: May 13, 2013, 09:09:25 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl
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« Reply #21 on: May 13, 2013, 09:17:01 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl

at last some sense itt

stack is worth nothing like 3k euro for that reason

overlay considerations can only be taken into accoutn for people that make the final too pretty much so v difficult to price
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YEAHMAN123
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« Reply #22 on: May 13, 2013, 09:24:42 AM »

Ross, I would still say 20k is not a short stack at all with the blinds starting at 100/200 ( which is similar to any deepstacks that we usually play at DTD), ofcourse the cost of travel accommodation and any other logistics needed to be looked at.. But the opportunity like this dont come often... YEAHMAN!!!

suppose some will be happy to play regardless of stack. they may have a side event they plan to play and also live or have family in/near london. i expect all these factors play a part in decisions vinod. but ur right this does not come around each year does it Smiley i wana see u there m8
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YEAHMAN123
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« Reply #23 on: May 13, 2013, 09:33:47 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl

yeah i agree totally bud. if  for example you based seat value at £2200 with 1250 runners at london you would have to finish in top 234 for profit £63 returned for £55 is that correct,i think so. but you do get some sort of return before that just not more than £55.

other examples - 27th would return £477.00
12th - £1141.00
3rd - £13396.00 (will no doubt be more with deals allowed)

so at the top its still great return for £55 is it not? is that not what backers back for?
 im just debating and speculating of course Wink

interesting the vibe seems to be that selling is bad idea for both parties. i think this is not the case but interesting

Smurf hurry up and get your day2 seat!!! quit messing around Wink
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YEAHMAN123
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« Reply #24 on: May 13, 2013, 09:38:58 AM »

bloodyhell i just realised i based 5% on £1100 insted of £2200, see this is my feeble attempt at trying to be smart lol (it is monday though). so i divide my calculation by 2? i think
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Doobs
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« Reply #25 on: May 13, 2013, 09:45:30 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl

at last some sense itt

stack is worth nothing like 3k euro for that reason

overlay considerations can only be taken into accoutn for people that make the final too pretty much so v difficult to price

This is just a complete failure of logic.  It is like saying that my buy in to the Main Event isn't worth any where near $10k as I have to get in the top 10% to break even.  


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« Reply #26 on: May 13, 2013, 10:20:17 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl

at last some sense itt

stack is worth nothing like 3k euro for that reason

overlay considerations can only be taken into accoutn for people that make the final too pretty much so v difficult to price

This is just a complete failure of logic.  It is like saying that my buy in to the Main Event isn't worth any where near $10k as I have to get in the top 10% to break even.  




The difference being in the wsop main event any backer at 1/1 would near enough double their money on a min cash of the last 10%

The ISPT for the same double based on a day two staking would require the player to get to the last 5%

Surely that makes it a different calculation?

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theprawnidentity
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« Reply #27 on: May 13, 2013, 10:22:18 AM »

Face Value of Seat: 2520 euro

I would suggest the seat would be worth more than this for a number reasons, the two main reasons being the 10% overlay plus the fact that having 8k less for a start would be no real detriment given the tournament is so deep/ slow structured.  We also have the benefit of the top 50% of places making a slight return on the investment.  A 10% increase for these factors doesnt seem to unreasonable to me.

Actual Value of Seat (+10%): 2750 euro

Then we have the issue of mark up.  This is a big field, well publicised tournament that will have a lot of soft players who have made it through the 300 euro comp.  We have to travel to London which will mean large overheads for the trip.  I dont think that 1.3 markup would be unreasonable.

Value of Seat + Markup (30%): 3575 euro

Coverted (XE): 3,575.00 EUR =  3,017.46 GBP  (Call it £3000 irl)

So I would sell as much as you want to @:

1% = £30
5% = £150
10% = £300

Ill read again later and see if I messed this up somewhere.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 10:25:12 AM by tomsom87 » Logged
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« Reply #28 on: May 13, 2013, 10:32:12 AM »

Don't know much about selling stakes but surely the fact that payouts are based on day one entry costs and not day two makes it a completely different ball game

50% of the field get paid but you would have to make the last 10% of the day two field for any staker to break even

http://www.ispt-poker.co.uk/couk/payout/

I'd take the costs Ross and go for it - your stack is near as average as it could be. Gl

at last some sense itt

stack is worth nothing like 3k euro for that reason

overlay considerations can only be taken into accoutn for people that make the final too pretty much so v difficult to price

This is just a complete failure of logic.  It is like saying that my buy in to the Main Event isn't worth any where near $10k as I have to get in the top 10% to break even.  




The difference being in the wsop main event any backer at 1/1 would near enough double their money on a min cash of the last 10%

The ISPT for the same double based on a day two staking would require the player to get to the last 5%

Surely that makes it a different calculation?



It does not.  A players equity remains the same irrespective of the pay structure (assuming it pays out 100% of the prize money in total).  The pay structure can increase / reduce variance, but not the players edge in the tournament.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2013, 10:34:13 AM by tomsom87 » Logged
YEAHMAN123
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« Reply #29 on: May 13, 2013, 11:41:27 AM »

Face Value of Seat: 2520 euro

I would suggest the seat would be worth more than this for a number reasons, the two main reasons being the 10% overlay plus the fact that having 8k less for a start would be no real detriment given the tournament is so deep/ slow structured.  We also have the benefit of the top 50% of places making a slight return on the investment.  A 10% increase for these factors doesnt seem to unreasonable to me.

Actual Value of Seat (+10%): 2750 euro

Then we have the issue of mark up.  This is a big field, well publicised tournament that will have a lot of soft players who have made it through the 300 euro comp.  We have to travel to London which will mean large overheads for the trip.  I dont think that 1.3 markup would be unreasonable.

Value of Seat + Markup (30%): 3575 euro

Coverted (XE): 3,575.00 EUR =  3,017.46 GBP  (Call it £3000 irl)

So I would sell as much as you want to @:

1% = £30
5% = £150
10% = £300

Ill read again later and see if I messed this up somewhere.

 thks tomsom Smiley
guess it has a plus side paying half the field so you get abit of your money back. but also i understand that any decent return can only be found in top 30 at 1.3, i would consider 1.2 though cos final table holds so much money which would attract backers would you think??

thks for post Smiley
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