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Poll
Question: How will you vote on December 12th 2019
Conservative - 19 (33.9%)
Labour - 12 (21.4%)
SNP - 2 (3.6%)
Lib Dem - 8 (14.3%)
Brexit - 1 (1.8%)
Green - 6 (10.7%)
Other - 2 (3.6%)
Spoil - 0 (0%)
Not voting - 6 (10.7%)
Total Voters: 55

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Author Topic: The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged  (Read 2180349 times)
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« Reply #17160 on: April 11, 2019, 12:32:27 PM »

http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2019/04/08/company-offering-chance-to-be-induced-into-coma-until-brexit-is-over/
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« Reply #17161 on: April 11, 2019, 12:40:06 PM »

Spanish PM says Brexit shows what goes wrong when decision making is 'based on lies'

Pedro Sánchez, said:

“The most important lesson we need to learn from what’s happening in the UK is that when decision-making processes, based on lies, are put in the hands of the people, societies – in this case British society – wind up down a blind alley”
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« Reply #17162 on: April 11, 2019, 01:03:45 PM »

People like to pontificate a lot about humiliation blah. It doesn't look great for the EU that they want/need to avoid no deal by keep changing deadlines as they really do need us much more than we need them..whatever the received narrative is. Its great that the UK has the integrity to avoid pressing home our superior position with terms that would hurt them
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« Reply #17163 on: April 11, 2019, 01:38:51 PM »

People like to pontificate a lot about humiliation blah. It doesn't look great for the EU that they want/need to avoid no deal by keep changing deadlines as they really do need us much more than we need them..whatever the received narrative is. Its great that the UK has the integrity to avoid pressing home our superior position with terms that would hurt them

i suspect you are very tongue in cheek here but here goes

No one on either side (in the negotiations, not the ERG) wants no deal, its untenable. We are clearly more affected than them, and by all accounts far less ready too.

Our superior position is such that our Prime Minister now waits in side rooms while the EU27 decides how long to extend for. Taking back control it is not.

31st October is a complicated one for the Tory party. Plans were, from the ERG wing, to get her to go in the summer, replace with a hard brexiteer, autumn election, win a majority on a brexit platform then out. Could have done that far easier if they'd have extended 12-18 months

As is, with the version of Brexit the ERG wants undeliverable in the commons  and May's WA unable to pass the scene is set for another six months of drift while the clock is ticking. All really because people on all sides still refuse to compromise

If JRM and the odious Mark Francois, the ridiculous David Davis (still prattling on about May getting the EU to remove the backstop, refusal to do so is a complete red line for the EU because of Ireland) and the rest had merely accepted that the WA at least got us out and go from there, we'd be Brexited by now 

As it is their lack of compromise still has revoke as a possibility, at least as likely as no deal imo.

 
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« Reply #17164 on: April 11, 2019, 01:51:04 PM »

I just don't think the ERG/no dealers get the Irish question, still. Hence their unreasonable demands to get the EU to effectively dump on Ireland and ditch the backstop

To understand why the UK failed to see the Brexit NI problem, it is worth asking why no one in London ever talks about John Hume. This thread didn't get it either until way after the leave vote, was hardly mentioned on here pre-referendum

Below is from one of Ireland's most senior diplomats Dan Mulhall.

https://www.dfa.ie/irish-embassy/usa/about-us/ambassador/ambassadors-blog/blog/blog-on-john-hume-an-irish-peacemaker-and-european-statesman.html

When RTE had a public vote less than a decade ago on Ireland's Greatest person, Hume beat Michael Collins, the man who won independence and founded the state. Hume is the intellectual architect of the GFA, not David Trimble. Trimble also did the deal but it was Hume who worked out the three strands -  internal power sharing, North-South, East-West - and built up US and EU goodwill over years. More than anything it was Hume's vision that a deal could be done where it wasn't one side wins, the other loses vis a vis loyalists and republicans.

All of this has been accepted by the Irish state, and the UK state (and we) should have seen how profoundly Brexit was jeopardising something fundamental to a continuing EU member state and its citizens, many of whom are also UK citizens.

Hume is one of the few UK MPs to ever win a Nobel peace prize, and his broad architecture of peace is the one that the EU is trying to preserve via the backstop. The EU is never going to ditch the backstop. ANY deal has to have a solution to it and the withdrawal agreement,however unsatisfactory, was the only attempt to get over the line.

It takes some level of disrespect (or possibly just a lack of knowledge, for which someone like David Davis has no excuse but obviously general members of the public do) from those trying to force no deal Brexit on us to even think of imperilling the achievements of John Hume and others in bringing about the GFA.

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« Reply #17165 on: April 11, 2019, 02:22:20 PM »

I cannot overstate what an utter shitshow events in the House of Commons currently are.

They have been given a six month extension.

They are using it to repeat, verbatim, all the same old futile garbage that has got them absolutely nowhere for the last two years.

So....

The DUP is telling Theresa May to use the threat of no-deal to extract changes to the backstop. (This can't work the EU won't do it and the EU don't believe we could countenance no deal. Might be more of a threat under a hard brexiteer prime minister of course)

Anna Soubry and Hilary Benn are telling her to use the time to have a People's Vote.


Switches Parliament channel off.
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« Reply #17166 on: April 11, 2019, 02:37:47 PM »

I cannot overstate what an utter shitshow events in the House of Commons currently are.

They have been given a six month extension.

They are using it to repeat, verbatim, all the same old futile garbage that has got them absolutely nowhere for the last two years.

So....

The DUP is telling Theresa May to use the threat of no-deal to extract changes to the backstop. (This can't work the EU won't do it and the EU don't believe we could countenance no deal. Might be more of a threat under a hard brexiteer prime minister of course)

Anna Soubry and Hilary Benn are telling her to use the time to have a People's Vote.


Switches Parliament channel off.
Its just too pathetic isn't it. Hard to disagree re ERG characters like francois and I used to quite respect the integrity of some of the ERG until you look back at what they were saying just a few years ago and how much it has changed. I'm almost reduced to only agreeing with Ken Clarkes views in the round.

Theresa in fairness just sat coolly in a side room while they argued about how best to capitulate to our latest demands to carry on doing nothing of note.
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« Reply #17167 on: April 11, 2019, 02:38:10 PM »

And they have reinstated their holidays!

I would love a peoples vote.....

Bring back Guy Fawkes

[  ] Yes

[  ] No

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« Reply #17168 on: April 11, 2019, 02:47:33 PM »

And they have reinstated their holidays!

I would love a peoples vote.....

Bring back Guy Fawkes

[  ] Yes

[  ] No



Let’s not forget that Guy Fawkes failed.

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« Reply #17169 on: April 11, 2019, 03:27:04 PM »

.
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« Reply #17170 on: April 11, 2019, 03:45:42 PM »

article on that poll

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/elections/2019/04/are-labour-really-heading-landslide-win-european-elections
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« Reply #17171 on: April 11, 2019, 03:53:16 PM »

Would really struggle to care less about voting in any European elections, pretty much the dictionary definition of pointless.
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« Reply #17172 on: April 11, 2019, 04:08:07 PM »


The conclusion from the article

“The one thing I would say is I wouldn't use this
as a yardstick for any of the parties' performances,
or draw any sweeping conclusions as a result.”
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« Reply #17173 on: April 12, 2019, 11:54:47 AM »

Farage's new party website :/

https://thebrexitparty.com
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« Reply #17174 on: April 12, 2019, 12:30:08 PM »

Farage's new party website :/

https://thebrexitparty.com

As someone has pointed out on Twitter already, their logo is literally an arrow pointing to the far right.

https://twitter.com/danbloom1/status/1116651561910984705?s=20
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