The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[ripple11]

98 reasons to stay in the EU:


Membership of the world’s largest trading bloc with over 500 million consumers, representing 23% of global GDP
The UK has greater global influence as a member of the EU
The EU provides a counterweight to the global power of the US, Russia and China
With Trump in the White House the UK’s strongest natural allies are France, Germany and our other West European neighbours
Tariff-free trade within the EU
The abolition of non-tariff barriers (quotas, subsidies, administrative rules etc.) among members
Participation in free trade agreements with Japan and Canada as an EU member
The EU accounts for 44% of all UK exports of goods and services
The EU accounts for 53% of all UK imports of goods and services
Cheaper food and alcohol imports from continental Europe
As a member of the EU the UK maintains a say in the shaping of the rules governing its trade with its European partners
3.1 million jobs in the UK are directly linked to exports to the EU
Free movement of labour has helped UK firms plug skills gaps (translators, doctors, plumbers)
Free movement of labour has helped address shortages of unskilled workers (fruit picking, catering)
The Single Market has brought the best continental footballers to the Premier League
The EU accounts for 47% of the UK’s stock of inward Foreign Direct Investment (FDI), worth over $1.2 trillion
Access to the EU Single Market has helped attract investment into the UK from outside the EU
No paperwork or customs for UK exports throughout the single market
Price transparency and removal of commissions on currency transactions across the Eurozone
FDI into the UK has effectively doubled since the creation of the EU Single Market
The UK’s net contribution to the EU budget is around €7.3bn, or 0.4% of GDP (less than an eighth of the UK’s defence spending)
No time consuming border checks for travellers (apart from in the UK)
The City of London, as a global financial hub, has acted as a bridge between foreign business and the EU
British banks and insurance companies have been able to operate freely across the EU
Cornwall receives up to £750 million per year from the EU Social Fund (ESF)
Structural funding for areas of the UK hit by industrial decline (South Wales, Yorkshire)
Support for rural areas under the European Agricultural Fund for Regional Development (EAFRD)
EU funding for infrastructure projects in the UK including £122 million for the “Midlands engine” project
Financial support from the EU for over 3,000 small and medium enterprises (SMEs) in the UK
EU funding for the British film industry
EU funding for British theatre, music and dance
EU funding for British sport, including football apprenticeships, tennis and rugby league
Glasgow (1990) and Liverpool (2008) benefitted from being European capitals of culture, stimulating their local economies
EU competition laws protect consumers by combatting monopolistic business practices
Strict controls on the operations of Multinational Corporations (MNCs) in the EU
Human Rights protected under the EU Charter of Fundamental Rights
The death penalty can never be reintroduced as it is incompatible with EU membership
Minority languages such as Welsh and Irish are recognized and protected under EU law
The right to reside in any EU member state
The freedom to work in 28 countries without visa and immigration restrictions
The mutual recognition of professional qualifications has facilitated the free movement of engineers, teachers and doctors across the EU
The mutual recognition of educational diplomas
The Common European Framework of Reference for Languages (CEFR) has standardized assessment of language proficiency across the EU
The freedom to study in 28 countries (many EU universities teach courses in English and charge lower fees than in the UK)
The Erasmus programme of university exchanges (benefitting 16000 UK students a year)
The freedom to set up a business in 28 countries
The ability to retire in any member state
Pension transferability
The right to vote in local and European Parliamentary elections if resident in any member state
EU laws making it easier for British people to buy property on the continent
The right to receive emergency healthcare in any member state (EHIC card)
Consular protection from any EU embassy outside the EU
The EU has played a leading role in combatting global warming (Paris 2015 climate change conference)
Common EU greenhouse gas emissions targets (19% reduction from 1990 to 2015)
Improvements in air quality (significant reductions in sulphur dioxide and nitrogen oxides) as a result of EU legislation
Reductions in sewage emissions
Improvements in the quality of beaches and bathing water
EU standards on the quality of drinking water
Restrictions on landfill dumping
EU targets for recycling
Common EU regulations on the transportation and disposal of toxic waste
The implementation of EU policies to reduce noise pollution in urban areas
EU policies have stimulated offshore wind farms
Strict safety standards for cars, buses and trucks
Protection of endangered species and habitats (EU Natura 2000 network)
Strict ban on animal testing in the cosmetics industry
Membership of the European Medicines Agency (EMA) which monitors the quality and safety of medicines (until recently located in London)
13% of EU budget earmarked for scientific research and innovation
The UK receives £730 million a year in EU funding for research
EU funding for UK universities
Cooperation in the peaceful use of nuclear energy as a member of Euratom
Minimum paid annual leave and time off work (Working Time Directive)
Equal pay between men and women enshrined in European law since 1957
The right to work no more than 48 hours a week without paid overtime
Minimum guaranteed maternity leave of 14 weeks for pregnant women
Rights to a minimum 18 weeks of parental leave after child birth
EU anti-discrimination laws governing age, religion and sexual orientation
EU rules governing health and safety at work
The rights to collective bargaining and trade union membership are enshrined in EU employment law
The UK enjoys an opt out from the single currency and maintains full control of its borders as a non-member of the Schengen area
Since 1985 the UK has received a budget rebate equivalent to 66% of its net contribution to the EU budget
EU cross-country coordination offers greater protection from terrorists, pedophiles, people traffickers and cyber-crime
The European common arrest warrant
Europe-wide patent and copyright protection
EU consumer protection laws concerning transparency and product guarantees of quality and safety
Improved food labeling
A ban on growth hormones and other harmful food additives
Cheaper air travel due to EU competition laws
Common EU air passenger rights
Deregulation of the European energy market has increased consumer choice and lowered prices
Mutual recognition of the common European driving license
The introduction of the European pet passport
The abolition of mobile telephone roaming charges
The EU acts as a guarantor of the Irish Good Friday Agreement
A frictionless Irish border
The EU acts as a guarantor of the special status of Gibraltar
The EU helped support and maintain democracy in Spain, Portugal and Greece from the 1970s and these countries have become major destinations for British tourists
EU membership has helped facilitate intercultural dialogue
Found via Campaign to Remain – keep Britain in Europe Facebook page

.........but you can't fit that on the side of a bus.

[engy]

Do we think if those 98 points were put out there by the remain campaign before the vote the outcome would have been different?

[kukushkin88]

Do we think if those 98 points were put out there by the remain campaign before the vote the outcome would have been different?

I don’t think so, I think the major appeal of the leave vote was the opportunity not to be constrained by reality. If you’re not the sharpest tool in the box, it’s easy to see why an optimistic and enthusiastic disregard for reality would be appealing.

[MANTIS01]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

[kukushkin88]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

The plan is revoke Article 50, accompanied by a raft of apologies to folks like you from the likes of DC, May, Boris and Gove.

[MANTIS01]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

The plan is revoke Article 50, accompanied by a raft of apologies to folks like you from the likes of DC, May, Boris and Gove.

Would the next plan be to revoke the GE result and put Corbyn on the throne?

[kukushkin88]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

The plan is revoke Article 50, accompanied by a raft of apologies to folks like you from the likes of DC, May, Boris and Gove.

Would the next plan be to revoke the GE result and put Corbyn on the throne?

No.

[kukushkin88]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

The plan is revoke Article 50, accompanied by a raft of apologies to folks like you from the likes of DC, May, Boris and Gove.

Would the next plan be to revoke the GE result and put Corbyn on the throne?

No.

but we can add him to list of people that owe you an apology.

[TightEnd]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

Plan has been consistent all along

1 Don't leave. Result fail. Peoples vote espoused by some but not all, many remainers do recognise that the democratic result has to be expected though as we don't know the details of what the democratic result was asking for, its all a bit blind man up an alley. Result fail so far

2 Softest possible brexit, consistent with narrow leave win, and no clearly defined brexit and economic risk. Result fail, May went for harder brexit

3 Stop No deal, stop potential bypassing of parliament/prorogation. If we have to leave, leave with a deal. Result unknown. Many Conservative remainers voted for May's deal three times, most Labour remainers didn't (an error i think) It was the ERG's desire for a "pure" Brexit that is the only reason we are not now out.

4 Long term if no brexit solution is possible (result unknown but probability up) revoke. Result unknown.

I think that has a consistency to it.

What exactly is the leave plan again? One that satisfies the Irish border question, protects the economy and then moves us towards a trade deal with the EU and everywhere else?

 

[TightEnd]

One thing from Panorama last night

Selmayr and Lidlington both accepted that at one point a "remain and reform" offer was on the table, proposed by the EU

moratorium for 5 years, build a new deal, PR it as more in our favour (the rebates are already hugely in our favour, no schengen, no euro too etc but still)

Lidlington, an ardent pro-european, said it wasn't taken forward as the result of the referendum has to be accepted

Whilst that is laudable, what a missed opportunity! the leave vote could have led somewhere positive. All the EU benefits, at even less cost, because of the leverage the vote had produced to cause it

Little leverage since.

[TightEnd]

here is corroboration

"Martin Selmayr, the EU’s most senior civil servant, offered David Lidington the opportunity to put Brexit on ice and instead chase a “new deal for Europe” at a private dinner last summer. The de facto deputy prime minister revealed that Mr Selmayr wanted the British Government to play a leading role, alongside France and Germany, in reforming the Brussels bloc. A turbulent G7 summit in Charlevoix, Canada, where Donald Trump clashed with EU leaders and Theresa May, helped hatch the plan, according to Mr Selmayr."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1154830/Brexit-news-UK-EU-Martin-Selmayr-Michel-Barnier-Boris-Johnson-latest-update

[TightEnd]

Absolutely inspired again

Will brighten up your day

https://twitter.com/MrMichaelSpicer/status/1152185504554606592?s=19

[MANTIS01]

Amazeballs that a constant Remain criticism is What is the plan? We have no plan?

Yet every day the message from Remain is Lol at how stupid people are. Look at how fucked we are.

What a tremendous plan

Plan has been consistent all along

1 Don't leave. Result fail. Peoples vote espoused by some but not all, many remainers do recognise that the democratic result has to be expected though as we don't know the details of what the democratic result was asking for, its all a bit blind man up an alley. Result fail so far

2 Softest possible brexit, consistent with narrow leave win, and no clearly defined brexit and economic risk. Result fail, May went for harder brexit

3 Stop No deal, stop potential bypassing of parliament/prorogation. If we have to leave, leave with a deal. Result unknown. Many Conservative remainers voted for May's deal three times, most Labour remainers didn't (an error i think) It was the ERG's desire for a "pure" Brexit that is the only reason we are not now out.

4 Long term if no brexit solution is possible (result unknown but probability up) revoke. Result unknown.

I think that has a consistency to it.

What exactly is the leave plan again? One that satisfies the Irish border question, protects the economy and then moves us towards a trade deal with the EU and everywhere else?

 

At what point does this plan change to acceptance? Leave 60%? Leave 70%?

What level of detail satisfies your requirements during referendum campaign to accept? Quite good detail? Thorough detail? Perfect detail?

My plan was after referendum we all unite, get the best deal poss, move forward. Fail.

Now that you have buggered that plan and are blocking viability of a good deal/new plan the onus is on you to implement a practical plan that works using your methodology

[TightEnd]

A deal, acceptable enough, was blocked three times and voted down by hard-line leave MPs (the marginal voter in each vote)

Given the Irish issues it was the best deal possible.

They are only reason we are not now out and moving onto trading arrangements with the EU and others

Nothing to do with remainers. It's self-inflicted by leavers I am afraid.

[kukushkin88]

Absolutely inspired again

Will brighten up your day

https://twitter.com/MrMichaelSpicer/status/1152185504554606592?s=19

Wonderful 😂. The comedy is definitely a silver lining on the cloud  of having such a fool as PM.