blonde poker forum
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
March 29, 2024, 07:05:27 AM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
2272476 Posts in 66752 Topics by 16945 Members
Latest Member: Zula
* Home Help Arcade Search Calendar Guidelines Login Register
+  blonde poker forum
|-+  Community Forums
| |-+  The Lounge
| | |-+  The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged
0 Members and 4 Guests are viewing this topic. « previous next »
Poll
Question: How will you vote on December 12th 2019
Conservative - 19 (33.9%)
Labour - 12 (21.4%)
SNP - 2 (3.6%)
Lib Dem - 8 (14.3%)
Brexit - 1 (1.8%)
Green - 6 (10.7%)
Other - 2 (3.6%)
Spoil - 0 (0%)
Not voting - 6 (10.7%)
Total Voters: 55

Pages: 1 ... 237 238 239 240 [241] 242 243 244 245 ... 1533 Go Down Print
Author Topic: The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged  (Read 2180850 times)
Doobs
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 16570


View Profile
« Reply #3600 on: June 25, 2016, 02:13:56 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the EU as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

And where is the consistency between wanting to leave the UK, but not wanting to leave the EU?  I can understand those who want to do both, even if I think they are wrong, and I can understand those who want to be part of both.  

This is clearly just political opportunism for her party's own self interest.   At least poker broker is consistent in wanting to leave both. 
Logged

Most of the bets placed so far seem more like hopeful punts rather than value spots
kukushkin88
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 3892



View Profile
« Reply #3601 on: June 25, 2016, 02:15:44 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the UK as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

I know you are prob just trolling as usual but I'll say it again:

In the Scottish elections in May, the SNP said in their manifesto that if Scotland significantly voted to stay in the EU and the rUK voted out, they would ask for a second independence referendum.  I really don't see what you don't understand - she has to stand by the manifesto and has absolutely no choice other than raise the issue of another referendum.



Debating with Mantis Is a tough gig. He's the ultimate sophist, it all sounds good but never adds up. This is the man who used to try and teach Flushy how to play poker on PHA.
Logged
Doobs
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 16570


View Profile
« Reply #3602 on: June 25, 2016, 02:20:02 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the UK as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

I know you are prob just trolling as usual but I'll say it again:

In the Scottish elections in May, the SNP said in their manifesto that if Scotland significantly voted to stay in the EU and the rUK voted out, they would ask for a second independence referendum.  I really don't see what you don't understand - she has to stand by the manifesto and has absolutely no choice other than raise the issue of another referendum.



So the can't go back on the manifesto, but it is perfectly ok to go back on the SNP leader's previous talk of a once in a generation Scottish independence referendum.  So long as we are consistent in our inconsistency on these things.

That was just put in the manifesto, to give an excuse to go back on the previous once in a generation talk.  

I simply struggle accept that somebody feels so strongly about staying in the EU could be strongly against staying in the UK.  You'd absolutely have to tie yourself in knots to explain that position.
Logged

Most of the bets placed so far seem more like hopeful punts rather than value spots
TightEnd
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: I am a geek!!



View Profile
« Reply #3603 on: June 25, 2016, 02:27:03 PM »

many scots have got what they want, no need to sign the 2nd referendum petition

inner london, green areas like brighton and bristol dominate

Logged

My eyes are open wide
By the way,I made it through the day
I watch the world outside
By the way, I'm leaving out today
TightEnd
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: I am a geek!!



View Profile
« Reply #3604 on: June 25, 2016, 02:30:44 PM »

Jeremy Corbyn walks off from LGBT Labour Pride2016 event after shouts of "resign" and "this is your fault".

think partly his fault is accurate, but more cameron's!
Logged

My eyes are open wide
By the way,I made it through the day
I watch the world outside
By the way, I'm leaving out today
MANTIS01
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6730


What kind of fuckery is this?


View Profile
« Reply #3605 on: June 25, 2016, 02:32:28 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the UK as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

I know you are prob just trolling as usual but I'll say it again:

In the Scottish elections in May, the SNP said in their manifesto that if Scotland significantly voted to stay in the EU and the rUK voted out, they would ask for a second independence referendum.  I really don't see what you don't understand - she has to stand by the manifesto and has absolutely no choice other than raise the issue of another referendum.


Mate you are one just trolling because my point is valid. Show me the part of her manifesto which commits her to call for a referendum on Day 1 or within a year or any time frame? So the point that right away, with the markets in chaos and general panic in the air she jumps in rather than providing the initial stability required is valid. What's more, after a significant majority voted for a UK last time the British Gov really don't need to comply by law. So how helpful is she being?

Anyway I don't rate her chances of success when she does go to the polls. The EU referendum didn't include questions about currency, financial black holes etc and all the other issues that the electorate rejected about independence last time. Undoubtedly they will reject it again, particularly if labour pull their socks up.
Logged

Tikay - "He has a proven track record in business, he is articulate, intelligent, & presents his cases well"

Claw75 - "Mantis is not only a blonde legend he's also very easy on the eye"

Outragous76 - "a really nice certainly intelligent guy"

taximan007 & Girgy85 & Celtic & Laxie - <3 Mantis
TightEnd
Administrator
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: I am a geek!!



View Profile
« Reply #3606 on: June 25, 2016, 02:32:38 PM »

trolled by a french newspaper

 Click to see full-size image.
Logged

My eyes are open wide
By the way,I made it through the day
I watch the world outside
By the way, I'm leaving out today
PokerBroker
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1189



View Profile
« Reply #3607 on: June 25, 2016, 03:01:51 PM »

I love working with people of all nationalities, I have learned so much about different cultures and histories just by talking to these people. In the hospitality trade most of the staff are foreign due to the fact that the British feel it's a career 'beneath them' and believe they are better than minimum wage.

Here in Guernsey a company has to advertise a job locally for 2 weeks before they can advertise worldwide, we get zero applications from local people!

The vote is done rather than all the doom and gloom I believe the UK will become stronger for it, but that's just my opinion.


You can go on about immigration etc, but the real, real root cause has been weak governments happy to pay tucking lazy stats too much to do nothing.

As taxi refers to, the fact people won't give up their dole money unless they get £x, is the initial problem. This then creates positions for immigrants to take, and so the circle begins. This country should never have a need to let people in to pick fruit because local unemployed think it is too hard work for the money.

If we had stronger Government that MADE people work, stuff such as trade agreements, the reason we joined the EU, would probably all still be in place.

You can't just make people work.  Not unless you become almost communist in outlook.  We have never had 100% employment. 

People won't work unless they get a decent day's pay, and why should they?  That sais at the other side of the spectrum there is proper greed.  We should have a cap and collar on salaries the cap shouldn't allow people to become filthy rich that they have so much money they don't know what to do with it, the collar should be set at a level were folk working were able to lead a decent standard of life. 


Sorry. Don't buy this.

Do we not have the minimum wage to counteract this.

Maybe you need to get out and about more. You dont have to go very far in any town to find people/families that could work, but choose not to because the system pays them enough so they dont need to. I suspect this number does run into millions.

You suspect wrong come out of your bubble fella. 

Would you get out your bed for NMW?  Moreso try looking after a family, imagine being a couple in your 20's both earning NMW try looking after a young family and a house with 2 children for example, it would be near to impossible to have any standard of living.  Give them a decent wage, they will spend it the economy wil be better for it they won't be claiming benefits. 
Logged
doubleup
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7049


View Profile
« Reply #3608 on: June 25, 2016, 03:17:42 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the UK as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

I know you are prob just trolling as usual but I'll say it again:

In the Scottish elections in May, the SNP said in their manifesto that if Scotland significantly voted to stay in the EU and the rUK voted out, they would ask for a second independence referendum.  I really don't see what you don't understand - she has to stand by the manifesto and has absolutely no choice other than raise the issue of another referendum.


Mate you are one just trolling because my point is valid. Show me the part of her manifesto which commits her to call for a referendum on Day 1 or within a year or any time frame? So the point that right away, with the markets in chaos and general panic in the air she jumps in rather than providing the initial stability required is valid. What's more, after a significant majority voted for a UK last time the British Gov really don't need to comply by law. So how helpful is she being?

Anyway I don't rate her chances of success when she does go to the polls. The EU referendum didn't include questions about currency, financial black holes etc and all the other issues that the electorate rejected about independence last time. Undoubtedly they will reject it again, particularly if labour pull their socks up.

Damn right she jumps in on day one - her concern is the Scottish people and Scottish jobs and investment.  She is making it 100% clear that she is going to do everything possible to keep Scotland in the EU in line with her manifesto.

I personally feel that she will fail in her endeavours as there are too many complications to be overcome in too little time.

Also you left out loss of EU membership in your list of subjects that were debated in the independence referendum.


Logged
PokerBroker
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 1189



View Profile
« Reply #3609 on: June 25, 2016, 03:22:30 PM »



I find Nicola Sturgeon has pounced on this turn of events to put her agenda back on the table.

it was clearly in her party's manifesto in the May elections, so hardly unexpected, in fact, the complete opposite.

The longer she leaves it the clearer the picture, the more variables the Scottish people have to work with. Calling for it on Day 1 is a different matter. Let's get the vote through while we're in a haze of confusion. I would expect a good leader to put leadership first.

wat?

It was in her manifesto, The UK as a whole voted to exit, Scotland didn't, where is the "haze of confusion"?



Lol wat? There wasn't a question about 'Scotland' in this referendum.

In fact if we analyse the data regarding the UK question put to the UK people we find there were MORE Scottish people who voted OUT or didn't vote at all than those who voted remain.

Yet in this new democracy that translates to Scotland voted to remain...even though that wasn't the question...and 33% chose not to answer the actual question. But meh let's just say Scotland voted to remain in the UK as an independent country. Democracy has been rinsed throughout this campaign and even more so now the result is in.

I know you are prob just trolling as usual but I'll say it again:

In the Scottish elections in May, the SNP said in their manifesto that if Scotland significantly voted to stay in the EU and the rUK voted out, they would ask for a second independence referendum.  I really don't see what you don't understand - she has to stand by the manifesto and has absolutely no choice other than raise the issue of another referendum.


Mate you are one just trolling because my point is valid. Show me the part of her manifesto which commits her to call for a referendum on Day 1 or within a year or any time frame? So the point that right away, with the markets in chaos and general panic in the air she jumps in rather than providing the initial stability required is valid. What's more, after a significant majority voted for a UK last time the British Gov really don't need to comply by law. So how helpful is she being?

Anyway I don't rate her chances of success when she does go to the polls. The EU referendum didn't include questions about currency, financial black holes etc and all the other issues that the electorate rejected about independence last time. Undoubtedly they will reject it again, particularly if labour pull their socks up.

Sturgeon or the SNP haven't yet called for a 2nd refernendum.

Scotland is feeling very self-satisfied and the flag waving has begun (literally, I saw Yes flags in a window this morning lol although come crazies haven't taken their Yes flags down since 2014). I think that might be a little premature. Of course if the UK leaves the EU that is a 'material and significant' change which would trigger indyref2. However we are not there yet. This is a game of chess, not draughts.

I think Corbyn wanted to vote Leave but was forced to vote Remain by the right of Labour. I also think Boris only voted Leave because he wants to be PM. Here's the thing. If Boris becomes PM (which i think he will) I would not be surprised to see him renegotiate with the EU. If he gets a better deal (and who couldn't?) we'll have another referendum and the UK stays in the EU on different terms. Now, if Sturgeon is part of that renegotiating team, agrees the new terms and campaigns for a Remain vote in EUref2 where does that leave Indyref2?

I understand the desire of the SNP to score political points and play to their gallery and the same can be said of SF's call for a 'Border Poll'. In many ways these are pieces of theatre. However it is worth remembering all these constitutional if's, but's and maybe's are underpinned by the need of the UK state to reconfigure itself. So while the EUref result is a blow to the governing class (and big business) they will already be thinking about how they can turn it to their advantage. That could mean federalism or confederalism, it could mean associate membership of the EU.

Or of course I could be totally wrong and the UK leaves the EU completely and Scotland is an independent Republic within 2 years and Ireland reunited within 3 years. 
Logged
BigAdz
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 8152



View Profile
« Reply #3610 on: June 25, 2016, 03:30:58 PM »

I love working with people of all nationalities, I have learned so much about different cultures and histories just by talking to these people. In the hospitality trade most of the staff are foreign due to the fact that the British feel it's a career 'beneath them' and believe they are better than minimum wage.

Here in Guernsey a company has to advertise a job locally for 2 weeks before they can advertise worldwide, we get zero applications from local people!

The vote is done rather than all the doom and gloom I believe the UK will become stronger for it, but that's just my opinion.


You can go on about immigration etc, but the real, real root cause has been weak governments happy to pay tucking lazy stats too much to do nothing.

As taxi refers to, the fact people won't give up their dole money unless they get £x, is the initial problem. This then creates positions for immigrants to take, and so the circle begins. This country should never have a need to let people in to pick fruit because local unemployed think it is too hard work for the money.

If we had stronger Government that MADE people work, stuff such as trade agreements, the reason we joined the EU, would probably all still be in place.

You can't just make people work.  Not unless you become almost communist in outlook.  We have never had 100% employment. 

People won't work unless they get a decent day's pay, and why should they?  That sais at the other side of the spectrum there is proper greed.  We should have a cap and collar on salaries the cap shouldn't allow people to become filthy rich that they have so much money they don't know what to do with it, the collar should be set at a level were folk working were able to lead a decent standard of life. 


Sorry. Don't buy this.

Do we not have the minimum wage to counteract this.

Maybe you need to get out and about more. You dont have to go very far in any town to find people/families that could work, but choose not to because the system pays them enough so they dont need to. I suspect this number does run into millions.

You suspect wrong come out of your bubble fella. 

Would you get out your bed for NMW?  Moreso try looking after a family, imagine being a couple in your 20's both earning NMW try looking after a young family and a house with 2 children for example, it would be near to impossible to have any standard of living.  Give them a decent wage, they will spend it the economy wil be better for it they won't be claiming benefits. 

No bubble here.

Your argument falls flat on every level.

If the immigrants are able to survive and get a foothold in life on the NMW why cant the rest? Do immigrants not have families either?

Do you never go into pubs at a lunch time and see blokes/families drinking that you know aren't working, and still claiming not enough money to live on? A TV in every room, a packet of fags each day, etc etc etc?

If you don't know any, you don't get out enough.

You are right, you cant MAKE people work, but you can give them so little, the work option is better than not being able to sit at home and stare at 4 walls until their next dole payment.
Logged

Good evenink. I wish I had a girlfriend.......
doubleup
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 7049


View Profile
« Reply #3611 on: June 25, 2016, 03:31:52 PM »



..... I would not be surprised to see him renegotiate with the EU. If he gets a better deal (and who couldn't?) we'll have another referendum and the UK stays in the EU on different terms.

isn't happening buddy, I thought it was only remainers who were still stuck in the denial feedback loop with their pointless petitions.

The UK is leaving the EU and there will be no trade deal without freedom of movement, Cameron knows this and that's one of the reasons why he resigned.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2016, 03:33:40 PM by doubleup » Logged
MANTIS01
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 6730


What kind of fuckery is this?


View Profile
« Reply #3612 on: June 25, 2016, 03:39:04 PM »

When Sturgeon orates I find her tone rather sabre-rattling like some modern day Robert the Bruce character, like she wants to right historical wrongs. What she needs to consider is these new variables regarding EU membership were not variables William Wallace encountered. This is a whole fresh new chapter Nicola..brand new! So if she wants what's best for Scottish people and jobs I'd advise her to wait until the dust settles. Consider the new landscape properly. Then present an informed case to the electorate, something sadly missing from this EU campaign, rather than a knee-jerk reaction. How does she know Scotland going alone and maybe hooking up with the EU is better for Scotland...she really doesn't.

What we all need to consider is that we now have the opportunity to create our own future, it is what we make it. So let's get started! So many people currently hating on our country and holding us back because they didn't get their own way. Sad to see.
Logged

Tikay - "He has a proven track record in business, he is articulate, intelligent, & presents his cases well"

Claw75 - "Mantis is not only a blonde legend he's also very easy on the eye"

Outragous76 - "a really nice certainly intelligent guy"

taximan007 & Girgy85 & Celtic & Laxie - <3 Mantis
arbboy
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 13285


View Profile
« Reply #3613 on: June 25, 2016, 03:43:49 PM »

Head in hands man needed as I sit here agreeing with adzdonk!  Incredible scenes.
Logged
teddybloat
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 755


View Profile
« Reply #3614 on: June 25, 2016, 03:54:49 PM »

an independent scotland, a united ireland free from the UK, complete break up of the UK on the cards, all whilst preserving the free movement of people across eu borders.

turmoil amongst the politicos, markets crashing, prime ministers resigning, leader of the opposition on the run.

this week could only have been better if morrissey beheaded the queen and declared us a republic.

love it. my leave vote looks more productive with each tumultuous day

never had so much bang-for-buck at the ballot box.

Logged
Pages: 1 ... 237 238 239 240 [241] 242 243 244 245 ... 1533 Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.381 seconds with 23 queries.