The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

will be a fun day, then

[TightEnd]

What's missing in all the reports on no deal prep is (bear with me) prep for adverse effects of knowing no deal prep is happening. Stockpiling. Fall in consumer confidence. Potential economic impact is real.


i hesitate to ask for fear of derision from the usual suspect(s), but serious questions.....

Is anyone or has anyone moderating/moderated their spending and saving habits specifically because of the risk of no deal?

if not yet, might you?

have you at all considered stockpiling? might you?

[nirvana]

Nothing to see here

[TightEnd]

Nothing to see here

it was a fair comment :-)

[nirvana]

Nothing to see here

it was a fair comment :-)

Yah, but should read the whole thread first :-)

[Woodsey]

What's missing in all the reports on no deal prep is (bear with me) prep for adverse effects of knowing no deal prep is happening. Stockpiling. Fall in consumer confidence. Potential economic impact is real.


i hesitate to ask for fear of derision from the usual suspect(s), but serious questions.....

Is anyone or has anyone moderating/moderated their spending and saving habits specifically because of the risk of no deal?

if not yet, might you?

have you at all considered stockpiling? might you?

No to all the above.....

[nirvana]

This is not coming from Remainers. This is not project fear. Pro-Brexit Ministers are drawing up blueprints for the army to deliver food, fuel and medicine if we leave the EU with no deal.

We have a duty to prevent this self-immolation don't we?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/army-on-standby-for-no-deal-brexit-emergency-dz3359lrf

If things could be as dire as some people predict than I'd take your ticket on this for sure. Shortages of medicines for example is hard to be sanguine about.

But Governments deliberately lie and mislead all the time to suit their political ends. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist in any sense as the propensity to lie, lie and lie again is not even a conspiracy - it's there in plain sight. If you can't see it today then a cursory whiz through any number of existential crises through history would reveal we were rarely told the truth.

A bit like MintTrav posted a few days ago - I'm pretty sure we will end up with the softest of brexits or remain and that the chance of no deal is pretty close to zero.

Whether that outcome will be due to the fact that brave, principled, politicians ensured we didn't carry through with the self immolation approach or because lying or manipulation and collusion (by the UK and the EU) changed public opinion here then I guess only time will tell

[TightEnd]

This is not coming from Remainers. This is not project fear. Pro-Brexit Ministers are drawing up blueprints for the army to deliver food, fuel and medicine if we leave the EU with no deal.

We have a duty to prevent this self-immolation don't we?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/army-on-standby-for-no-deal-brexit-emergency-dz3359lrf

If things could be as dire as some people predict than I'd take your ticket on this for sure. Shortages of medicines for example is hard to be sanguine about.

But Governments deliberately lie and mislead all the time to suit their political ends. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist in any sense as the propensity to lie, lie and lie again is not even a conspiracy - it's there in plain sight. If you can't see it today then a cursory whiz through any number of existential crises through history would reveal we were rarely told the truth.

A bit like MintTrav posted a few days ago - I'm pretty sure we will end up with the softest of brexits or remain and that the chance of no deal is pretty close to zero.

Whether that outcome will be due to the fact that brave, principled, politicians ensured we didn't carry through with the self immolation approach or because lying or manipulation and collusion (by the UK and the EU) changed public opinion here then I guess only time will tell

the loss of majority/terrible election campaign makes it much tougher, being in thrall to the ERG and DUP who don't want to compromise, for any change of public opinion (not much sign of it yet to be fair) be reflected in a change of plans

in fact the loss of majority means as far as i read that no reasonable option has a majority in the commons

hence the assumption that the risk of no deal is far higher than "pretty close to zero"

[MANTIS01]

The final fact is that you could gather together all the nonsense from all the simpletons and it would be a speck of irrelevance on the illogical scale when compared to the advice to stockpile tinned fruit.

really? the Brexiters in government are now planning to stockpile food and still its illogical? the Medical regulator is warning about insulin and its still illogical? the government is having to move to get supplies of blood secured and its still illogical?

do you ever read the articles i link to?

please read the Ian Dunt food supply article provided in here thursday or friday.

link again to make it easy http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/07/27/this-is-what-no-deal-brexit-actually-looks-like

described as "probably the seminal article on the lunacy of Brexit"

a few weeks ago you were trying to claim that this would be blue sunlit uplands for the british farming industry. If it wasn't so sad it would be hilarious

Yo, I was surfing the web this week and noticed this astounding headline "Shoppers Furious at Empty Shelves". Sure enough the Twitters was going bat-shit crazy with a cascade of vitriol. Tweets to the manager of Aldi threatening to put dog poo through his letterbox. When I examined the photos they were indeed upon first glance..of empty shelves. Yet upon further examination to the left edge of the photo there was a full range of pizzas including "triple meat feast" which is a personal favourite. To the right edge of the photo, we arrived in the 'fresh fish' section where we found an impressive selection including caviar on special (I didn't know caviar was ever 'on special').

So mate, reading articles from panic-stricken snowflakes trying to paint pictures of Irish potato famine style disasters isn't on my radar. We don't know what a food shortage is. I'm confident I won't go hungry. But if does get to that stage maybe we can appeal to Africa for people to set up a DD for £20 a month.

On a kinda related note I saw all the travel chaos this weekend on the telly news where the roads were described as "utter carnage". They were interviewing a fella during his 4 hour "traffic jam hell" who said "been here for 4 hours now and no water. Disgusting!!" Not so sure who that was directed to but he was very angry about somebody not bringing water to his car. Such a snowflake comment. And I mean there clearly won't be a shortage of blood...because kids dying due to red tape isn't a vote-winner.

[TightEnd]

The final fact is that you could gather together all the nonsense from all the simpletons and it would be a speck of irrelevance on the illogical scale when compared to the advice to stockpile tinned fruit.

really? the Brexiters in government are now planning to stockpile food and still its illogical? the Medical regulator is warning about insulin and its still illogical? the government is having to move to get supplies of blood secured and its still illogical?

do you ever read the articles i link to?

please read the Ian Dunt food supply article provided in here thursday or friday.

link again to make it easy http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/07/27/this-is-what-no-deal-brexit-actually-looks-like

described as "probably the seminal article on the lunacy of Brexit"

a few weeks ago you were trying to claim that this would be blue sunlit uplands for the british farming industry. If it wasn't so sad it would be hilarious

Yo, I was surfing the web this week and noticed this astounding headline "Shoppers Furious at Empty Shelves". Sure enough the Twitters was going bat-shit crazy with a cascade of vitriol. Tweets to the manager of Aldi threatening to put dog poo through his letterbox. When I examined the photos they were indeed upon first glance..of empty shelves. Yet upon further examination to the left edge of the photo there was a full range of pizzas including "triple meat feast" which is a personal favourite. To the right edge of the photo, we arrived in the 'fresh fish' section where we found an impressive selection including caviar on special (I didn't know caviar was ever 'on special').

So mate, reading articles from panic-stricken snowflakes trying to paint pictures of Irish potato famine style disasters isn't on my radar. We don't know what a food shortage is. I'm confident I won't go hungry. But if does get to that stage maybe we can appeal to Africa for people to set up a DD for £20 a month.

On a kinda related note I saw all the travel chaos this weekend on the telly news where the roads were described as "utter carnage". They were interviewing a fella during his 4 hour "traffic jam hell" who said "been here for 4 hours now and no water. Disgusting!!" Not so sure who that was directed to but he was very angry about somebody not bringing water to his car. Such a snowflake comment. And I mean there clearly won't be a shortage of blood...because kids dying due to red tape isn't a vote-winner.

so you haven't read the article? I wish you would then you could explain in detail why Ian Dunt has no reason too fear.  It would require the same attention to detail and extensive research that Dunt has undertaken. 

I'm not holding my breath. 

[MANTIS01]

I just don't care if Ian Dunt is afraid. I am not afraid. Reading articles from people with food-shortage fears introduces what into my life? A full cupboard of peaches and err fear. I'm confident I won't go hungry. And on the subject of food that's all that matters to most people mate. Don't forget our relationship with USA is the highest degree of special so Trump might give us some soya beans to tide us over.

[TightEnd]

I don't know what to say anymore. Such a closed mind to the risks we are all facing. .

Never a single response from the ideologically stubborn leavers that allays the genuine fears such as

how a border will function in the event of a no deal Brexit? (it won't as things stand)
why a just in time system will function? (it won't as things stand)

the scary thing is that the Brexiteer Peter Pan audience shouting ‘I do believe in fairies’ is real life

[RickBFA]

Tighty, Mint posted a view a few days ago that I strongly agreed with (there’s a first  ).

It was basically that he expects it to go to the wire and that there will be some sort of fudged agreement.

I still think given our mutual interests then something will be agreed.

[4KSuited]

I accept that an "over the cliff edge" no deal Brexit would be a nightmare....

But that nightmare scenario pre-supposes that the EU are happy to walk away with a no deal. For balance, where's the article that goes through the implications for EU member states? Looks to me like the Dutch, French, Spanish and even the Germans will be significantly affected. So, I think that this is why there will end up being compromise by both parties before the deal can be agreed.

At the risk of stating the obvious here, it's critical that (in a negotiation) one implies that walking away is a real option. Trouble is, this can't be proven until the point at which one about faces. Yes, it's scary stuff.

[teddybloat]

I don't know what to say anymore. Such a closed mind to the risks we are all facing. .

Never a single response from the ideologically stubborn leavers that allays the genuine fears such as

how a border will function in the event of a no deal Brexit? (it won't as things stand)
why a just in time system will function? (it won't as things stand)

the scary thing is that the Brexiteer Peter Pan audience shouting ‘I do believe in fairies’ is real life

order will emerge though. it's the beauty of the economic system

we arent going to be facing generational problems whereby food wont be consumed and borders will be chaotic.

we dont know the solutions because the problems havent been framed exactly. it's all speculation about a complex and chaotic system.

i'm more than willing to suffer short term for the long term benfit of leaving. and i will double down on that when it comes to the democratic principle behind my leave vote.