The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[MANTIS01]

I don't know what to say anymore. Such a closed mind to the risks we are all facing. .

Never a single response from the ideologically stubborn leavers that allays the genuine fears such as

how a border will function in the event of a no deal Brexit? (it won't as things stand)
why a just in time system will function? (it won't as things stand)

the scary thing is that the Brexiteer Peter Pan audience shouting ‘I do believe in fairies’ is real life

btw I did read the article mate. It was the one that opened by comparing Brexit to a “Stephen King horror story” right?

[TightEnd]

I don't know what to say anymore. Such a closed mind to the risks we are all facing. .

Never a single response from the ideologically stubborn leavers that allays the genuine fears such as

how a border will function in the event of a no deal Brexit? (it won't as things stand)
why a just in time system will function? (it won't as things stand)

the scary thing is that the Brexiteer Peter Pan audience shouting ‘I do believe in fairies’ is real life

btw I did read the article mate. It was the one that opened by comparing Brexit to a “Stephen King horror story” right?

ok. Yes that's right (the metaphor).

[nirvana]

This is not coming from Remainers. This is not project fear. Pro-Brexit Ministers are drawing up blueprints for the army to deliver food, fuel and medicine if we leave the EU with no deal.

We have a duty to prevent this self-immolation don't we?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/army-on-standby-for-no-deal-brexit-emergency-dz3359lrf

If things could be as dire as some people predict than I'd take your ticket on this for sure. Shortages of medicines for example is hard to be sanguine about.

But Governments deliberately lie and mislead all the time to suit their political ends. I'm not really a conspiracy theorist in any sense as the propensity to lie, lie and lie again is not even a conspiracy - it's there in plain sight. If you can't see it today then a cursory whiz through any number of existential crises through history would reveal we were rarely told the truth.

A bit like MintTrav posted a few days ago - I'm pretty sure we will end up with the softest of brexits or remain and that the chance of no deal is pretty close to zero.

Whether that outcome will be due to the fact that brave, principled, politicians ensured we didn't carry through with the self immolation approach or because lying or manipulation and collusion (by the UK and the EU) changed public opinion here then I guess only time will tell

the loss of majority/terrible election campaign makes it much tougher, being in thrall to the ERG and DUP who don't want to compromise, for any change of public opinion (not much sign of it yet to be fair) be reflected in a change of plans

in fact the loss of majority means as far as i read that no reasonable option has a majority in the commons

hence the assumption that the risk of no deal is far higher than "pretty close to zero"

I agree with the first couple of paras but I think the third is fake news :-)

[nirvana]

I don't know what to say anymore. Such a closed mind to the risks we are all facing. .

Never a single response from the ideologically stubborn leavers that allays the genuine fears such as

how a border will function in the event of a no deal Brexit? (it won't as things stand)
why a just in time system will function? (it won't as things stand)

the scary thing is that the Brexiteer Peter Pan audience shouting ‘I do believe in fairies’ is real life

btw I did read the article mate. It was the one that opened by comparing Brexit to a “Stephen King horror story” right?

Must admit, my first thoughts from the opening paras were we won't be starving too much as we can eat all the food the Europeans won't now take

[MANTIS01]

Nah it’s not the metaphor it’s the constant metaphors, the overall attitude. Describing say the price of corn in a ‘death spiral”. It’s the biased positioning, the imparting of negative emotion rather than objective facts or balanced view, it’s the no mention of pressure on Europe leading to reform, it’s the lack of confidence in UK to be dexterous, react and it’s the lack of any solution proposed. Did nothing to convince me I need peaches and fear in my life.

[TightEnd]

Crikey. No Brexit proponent has proposed a single solution to these issues. You, and they, really are the pot and the kettle is black.

[RED-DOG]

Nah it’s not the metaphor it’s the constant metaphors, the overall attitude. Describing say the price of corn in a ‘death spiral”. It’s the biased positioning, the imparting of negative emotion rather than objective facts or balanced view, it’s the no mention of pressure on Europe leading to reform, it’s the lack of confidence in UK to be dexterous, react and it’s the lack of any solution proposed. Did nothing to convince me I need peaches and fear in my life.

I genuinely laughed out loud.

Have you read any of your posts?

[nirvana]

Crikey. No Brexit proponent has proposed a single solution to these issues. You, and they, really are the pot and the kettle is black.

My suggestion is they do a deal

[teddybloat]

there isnt a cut out solution to problems that haven't arose yet.

but when it comes to trade and getting buisiness done the market is flexible and innovative.

just as there are unintended consequences to planned changes, there will be all sorts of complexities arising from brexit.

but solutions will emerge, deals will be cut and trade will be done.

[MANTIS01]

Crikey. No Brexit proponent has proposed a single solution to these issues. You, and they, really are the pot and the kettle is black.

My suggestion is they do a deal

Like.

tbh think Tighty and Dunty are being little owly after-timers. Can somebody point me to the pre-brexit blood crisis and canned peach storage discussion?

[nirvana]

there isnt a cut out solution to problems that haven't arose yet.

but when it comes to trade and getting buisiness done the market is flexible and innovative.

just as there are unintended consequences to planned changes, there will be all sorts of complexities arising from brexit.

but solutions will emerge, deals will be cut and trade will be done.

I think this is very true and I think it would happen quite quickly. As one example we can think about food and JIT. Very short term it might make sense to stock slightly more goods - economics would dictate that, rather than stockpile, we would very soon buy from elsewhere if supply chains became unpredictable/unworkable through Dover - goods can be provided from any global location as the absolute transit time isn't relevant to whether goods are supplied JIT. An unintended consequence might be a boost to our ports outside Dover and our internal haulage industry.

[MANTIS01]

Incidentally, Googled Ian Dunt who was described as a "notorious twitter bore".

Also a "Human Rights activist", which came as little surprise.

[nirvana]

Crikey. No Brexit proponent has proposed a single solution to these issues. You, and they, really are the pot and the kettle is black.

My suggestion is they do a deal

Like.

tbh think Tighty and Dunty are being little owly after-timers. Can somebody point me to the pre-brexit blood crisis and canned peach storage discussion?

Recently, I had a good read through all the pages here in the run up to the referendum and the few months after that to try and understand what everyone was thinking at the time.

Obviously you tend to notice the things you got completely wrong, where you misunderstood, or where you've changed your own view. Also noticed things that were mentioned in the run up (like the Irish border) that hadn't really resonated with me very strongly at the time

But it was noticeable how much calmer remainers were in the first months after the referendum - much more of a feeling of 'let's get on with it' rather than 'omg, we're doomed and can't be undoomed' - maybe the deliberate or actual incompetence with which the Government appears to have gone about things has caused this

[MANTIS01]

We're all frustrated with the leadership right? But yeah the negative rhetoric has been ramped up as events have unfolded. Very owly. Only serves to weaken our negotiating position now we can't turn back time. Remain are now literally hopping-mad with people who voted for EU reform in the absence of the full stephen king horror story which is now so obvious. Think it's more to do with the demise of leftie politics tbh.

[Woodsey]

there isnt a cut out solution to problems that haven't arose yet.

but when it comes to trade and getting buisiness done the market is flexible and innovative.

just as there are unintended consequences to planned changes, there will be all sorts of complexities arising from brexit.

but solutions will emerge, deals will be cut and trade will be done.

I think this is very true and I think it would happen quite quickly. As one example we can think about food and JIT. Very short term it might make sense to stock slightly more goods - economics would dictate that, rather than stockpile, we would very soon buy from elsewhere if supply chains became unpredictable/unworkable through Dover - goods can be provided from any global location as the absolute transit time isn't relevant to whether goods are supplied JIT. An unintended consequence might be a boost to our ports outside Dover and our internal haulage industry.

I often check the source of my food when buying it, I try to buy British (and as local as possible) whenever I can. A fair chunk of the foreign fruit and veg comes from Africa, Spain can go fk themselves with that tasteless shit they try to mug us off with, anyone who buys that is a food pigeon....