The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[AndrewT]

Here's why Labour MPs are panicking. Brexit is the majority view across a large swathe of Labour territory

Click to see full-size image.

Bolsover (Dennis Skinner's constituency) votes 70% to Leave yet people still say Brexit is driven by right-wing racists.

Looking back in Labour history to trace when they lost the working class, two moments spring to mind. The first was Bigotgate - when a Labour-supporting woman asked Gordon Brown a question about the economy and happened to make a reference to E European immigration.

Gordon Brown's response was just to label her a bigot, and therefore dismiss all her concerns. I bet she voted to Leave.

The second was further back (and may not even be true but became too good a story for it not to be repeated) when Peter Mandleson was in a chippie in Hartlepool, saw a pot of mushy peas on the counter and said 'Oooh, guacamole'. Metropolitan Labour politician in a Northern constituency with no idea about the way the locals live.

[arbboy]

The Labour Party is just full of champagne socialists.

[TightEnd]

The Labour Party is just full of champagne socialists.

no, there are two distinct groups. metropolitan/london labour and heartland labour. problem is they have very different outlooks, virtually two different parties. one cannot speak to the other in a way they understand, and this started as Andrew implies about a decade ago onwards

[TightEnd]

(((Dan Hodges))) ‏@DPJHodges now1 minute ago

Staggering. Corbyn refused to tell Chris Bryant how he voted in the Referendum.

[Doobs]

Here's why Labour MPs are panicking. Brexit is the majority view across a large swathe of Labour territory

Click to see full-size image.

Bolsover (Dennis Skinner's constituency) votes 70% to Leave yet people still say Brexit is driven by right-wing racists.

Looking back in Labour history to trace when they lost the working class, two moments spring to mind. The first was Bigotgate - when a Labour-supporting woman asked Gordon Brown a question about the economy and happened to make a reference to E European immigration.

Gordon Brown's response was just to label her a bigot, and therefore dismiss all her concerns. I bet she voted to Leave.

The second was further back (and may not even be true but became too good a story for it not to be repeated) when Peter Mandleson was in a chippie in Hartlepool, saw a pot of mushy peas on the counter and said 'Oooh, guacamole'. Metropolitan Labour politician in a Northern constituency with no idea about the way the locals live.

Hold on.  Solihull is a labour seat?  Not getting that past me.

Can't remember the guacamole story, so not sure it can have changed much.  I think labour would simply do better with somebody more in touch with their heartlands.  Ed milliband came across terribly on that score.

[arbboy]

The Labour Party is just full of champagne socialists.

no, there are two distinct groups. metropolitan/london labour and heartland labour. problem is they have very different outlooks, virtually two different parties. one cannot speak to the other in a way they understand, and this started as Andrew implies about a decade ago onwards

Agreed but there are far too big % of non heartland labour types like burnham and skinner in the party for me.

[The Camel]

Here's why Labour MPs are panicking. Brexit is the majority view across a large swathe of Labour territory

Click to see full-size image.

Bolsover (Dennis Skinner's constituency) votes 70% to Leave yet people still say Brexit is driven by right-wing racists.

Looking back in Labour history to trace when they lost the working class, two moments spring to mind. The first was Bigotgate - when a Labour-supporting woman asked Gordon Brown a question about the economy and happened to make a reference to E European immigration.

Gordon Brown's response was just to label her a bigot, and therefore dismiss all her concerns. I bet she voted to Leave.

The second was further back (and may not even be true but became too good a story for it not to be repeated) when Peter Mandleson was in a chippie in Hartlepool, saw a pot of mushy peas on the counter and said 'Oooh, guacamole'. Metropolitan Labour politician in a Northern constituency with no idea about the way the locals live.

I was in Redcar yesterday because Jake was playing a football tournament.

I left the playing fields for a while to search for a petrol station and drove around some very run down and deprived areas.

There were St George's flags and Vote Leave posters everybloodywhere.

Now maybe this was partly due to England in the Euros and any remainers having taken down their posters...

But it really got me scared.

These people don't want socialism. Do they want National Socialism?

If Boris doesn't give them what they want with regard to immigration, how much of a shift in party policy would Farage have to give before UKIP is the voice of national socialism?

[TightEnd]

two more resignations

think that makes 13 front bench and 15 junior

Click to see full-size image.

if JC gets on the ballot he wins again, if he doesn't the party breaks up?

what a spot they are in

[MC]

[DaveShoelace]

(((Dan Hodges))) ‏@DPJHodges now1 minute ago

Staggering. Corbyn refused to tell Chris Bryant how he voted in the Referendum.

That is ridiculous. I look forward to PMQs this week where Cameron asks him six times if he voted leave.

What will happen with PMQs now all this is kicking off and Dave is about to go on his hols?

[TightEnd]

Paul Waugh ‏@paulwaugh now3 seconds ago

If Corbyn refuses to say if he voted Leave, this is causus belli that cd kill him
Voters and Lab will feel misled

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corbyn-refused-to-confirm-he-voted-remain-at-eu-referendum-claims-chris-bryant_uk_5770ff1fe4b0d2571149f599?edition=uk

[RED-DOG]

ok i am done, that sums up yesterday

see what today brings

Thanks Rich.


This thread has become compulsive reading for me. I love the way each new piece of news is analysed and dissected and I love hearing all the opinions and counter opinions of people who are, by and large, far more politically savvy than me.

I just hope that the contributors will continue to present their arguments in a robust but amicable fashion.

[neeko]

The biggest irony for me is that economic performance hinges on confidence and certainty and this is what all you economic experts are undermining with your negativity.

However, that said do economics experts believe we should bring back capital punishment? It's much cheaper to kill a fella than put him in prison for life. In fact why don't we bring in Sharia Law as it's going to be much more economically viable than the present UK justice system? Why don't we just close the NHS, we would save a fortune. Why did I go to Barbados on holiday rather than Bognor Regis this year? Why do we bowl around the world fighting wars to defend democracy? It's cheaper to not bother etc etc etc.

The British people have been driven by what it means to be British. We were ignored before, concerns weren't taken seriously, now we have spoken in a democratic process the idea is to continue ignoring the people because of economics? I hate to break it to the economics experts but economics isn't the driver for the majority here, we had the courage to ignore the scare stories and threats to stand up for what we think is right. That's what it means to be British. 

Oh incidentally check out how Nicola Sturgeon walks, she's got a little bops in her step, like those guys who wear their jeans around their ankles. Most peculiar.

It's not actually - it costs 2 - 3 times more due to the legal appeals - and then you have the problem of how to administer a legal injection as drug companies won't sell you the drugs to do it.

[DaveShoelace]

ok i am done, that sums up yesterday

see what today brings

Thanks Rich.


This thread has become compulsive reading for me. I love the way each new piece of news is analysed and dissected and I love hearing all the opinions and counter opinions of people who are, by and large, far more politically savvy than me.

I just hope that the contributors will continue to present their arguments in a robust but amicable fashion.

Sticky it up your bum silly face!

[The Camel]

(((Dan Hodges))) ‏@DPJHodges now1 minute ago

Staggering. Corbyn refused to tell Chris Bryant how he voted in the Referendum.

That is ridiculous. I look forward to PMQs this week where Cameron asks him six times if he voted leave.

What will happen with PMQs now all this is kicking off and Dave is about to go on his hols?

Staggering in a not at all very staggering way.

Obvious Corbyn voted leave. Galloway and Skinner voted leave too.