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Poll
Question: How will you vote on December 12th 2019
Conservative - 19 (33.9%)
Labour - 12 (21.4%)
SNP - 2 (3.6%)
Lib Dem - 8 (14.3%)
Brexit - 1 (1.8%)
Green - 6 (10.7%)
Other - 2 (3.6%)
Spoil - 0 (0%)
Not voting - 6 (10.7%)
Total Voters: 55

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Author Topic: The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged  (Read 2181199 times)
BigAdz
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« Reply #9165 on: June 03, 2017, 08:16:46 AM »

Just a lightle thought, perhaps a little contreversial one too, but are poker players racist.....
 
All I see on my Facebook since the run up the the referendum are most of them voting Brexit, sharing posts from EDL, "I am proud to be English" or their main reasoning behind their vote for Brexit being the immigration issue. Of course you question it and they say they ae not.

But since the news of the general election, it's gone in a similar way. Posts from the same groups, moaning about Corbyn, sharing photos that of course they are too dumb to realise are racist as hell and telling us all we must "double down" on out vote for brexit by voting Tory.

One player (he's only local) has been sharing photos from groups like "british and proud" and so on. Pictures of immigrants on boats, if a muslim is found theiving rip up their passport and so on. If you question him on it, he'll say he's not racist. He'll reply with a typical response of "my best mate is an immigrant" blah blah blah.

But these posts I see, they are 95% from poker players on my Facebook.

Does the poker community have an element or is significantly racist?

I still don't get that those of us that want controls on immigration, are considered racist.

I am happy to let people who have something valid to offer, a place in our country. Lets be very basic about this stuff, we all want our Indians, Chinese, Thai restaurants, etc to have people of that nationality working in them.

While we can't get enough of our own citizens to qualify as doctors, nurses etc, then we need immigration.

What I object to is seeing people on the street, clearly an immigrant, begging on the street, queuing for benefits etc. This is the immigration I want stopped, and I suspect, do the majority of people, they just get shouted down before they get to explain in full.. Those people that come over just to get a free ride on the back of hard working tax payers.

Anyone that wants us to continue letting in any old Tom dick or harry, is an idiot.


In terms of the election, Teresa May is getting the tough time she deserves for. Calling an election because her opponent is a bit of a liability. She should have done her remaining time, done a good job, and the rest would fall into place.

The thought of Corbyn, Abbott, et al, at the helm though, scares the shirt out of me.
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TightEnd
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« Reply #9166 on: June 03, 2017, 08:24:29 AM »

The whole nukes debate is a major example of the growing divide between young liberals & old social conservatives

Older social conservatives see it as matter of security, national interest. Chaotic world requires strong leader with deterrent

Young liberals see as aggressive instrument of mass murder, an obstacle to better and more multilateral, integrated world. No middle ground

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TightEnd
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« Reply #9167 on: June 03, 2017, 08:25:29 AM »

stephen B learnt SIX whole things from bbcqt:

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/june2017/2017/06/jeremy-corbyns-better-campaigner-theresa-may-and-five-other-things-we
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TightEnd
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« Reply #9168 on: June 03, 2017, 08:26:05 AM »

nb important

In seats where Labour are defending a majority of less than 5,000, over 65s outnumber 18-24s by an average of 5,000 voters.

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« Reply #9169 on: June 03, 2017, 08:49:14 AM »

But Adz, the economists have come out and said the effect on the proposed migration cap is going to cost the UK £16bil a year until 2020, then £6bil a year thereafter. That cost will no doubt he borne further by the UK tax payer so that argument doesn't hold much stock. If your issue is just generally with people abusing the benefits system then that's one thing but cutting immigration is going to be net negative for the tax payer.

For those begging, how can you be sure they aren't British or are EU nationals? I live in Brighton, which has one of the worst homelessness problems in the UK, anecdotally it seems the majority are British.
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« Reply #9170 on: June 03, 2017, 09:00:08 AM »

TM was strong on Brexit, little bit weak on social care and foreign aide.

Solid performance overall not spectactular, she is no Dave for sure.


I meant in terms of being a public orator which he was really good at. Not that he was a good pm far from it




Wtf DC resigned in disgrace, the most humiliated PM we've had since just before the 2nd Great War. You were jokng?

I meant in terms of being a good public orator which he was really good at. Not that he was a good pm far from it.
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« Reply #9171 on: June 03, 2017, 09:22:07 AM »

Seems incredible that we think he should compromise some of his principles to be more electable, literally the whole point is that he's spent his whole life with unshakeable principles that he believes are best for all people and that's what we on the left want in a politician. The alternative is people who will say or do literally anything to try and be electable. Their record suggests they'll change their mind on literally everything if the net result is a few more votes and approval from Dacre, Barclay, Murdoch.

I get it that Corbyn has principles and as a back bench MP, its easy to keep to those principles.

A leader is in a different position, especially if prime minister.

Sometimes you have to compromise, it's just part of the game they have to play.

Trouble for Corbyn is he just doesn't believe in his own party policy on trident. It's crazy to have an expensive deterrent policy in place if your leader won't use it and tells us he won't. It's like playing poker with your cards face up.

His principles (whilst admirable on a personal level) are part of the reason he will never be a leader.
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« Reply #9172 on: June 03, 2017, 09:36:00 AM »

Tighty, apologies if I've missed it. Who are you voting for?

Great thread btw
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« Reply #9173 on: June 03, 2017, 09:40:21 AM »



Smiley

I actually think, politics aside, Boris looked like he could 'ave him'
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« Reply #9174 on: June 03, 2017, 09:58:17 AM »



Smiley

I actually think, politics aside, Boris looked like he could 'ave him'

That has to be a level?  Boris is good entertainment but he's borderline retarded.  He can clean out school boys for sure but against an average joe I'd make him the underdog in a street fight. 

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« Reply #9175 on: June 03, 2017, 10:01:50 AM »



Smiley

I actually think, politics aside, Boris looked like he could 'ave him'

I popped out to the shop shortly after this and this same guy was on the radio getting shouty at Michael Fallon, I think it might be his default  Grin
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« Reply #9176 on: June 03, 2017, 10:05:00 AM »

Seems incredible that we think he should compromise some of his principles to be more electable, literally the whole point is that he's spent his whole life with unshakeable principles that he believes are best for all people and that's what we on the left want in a politician. The alternative is people who will say or do literally anything to try and be electable. Their record suggests they'll change their mind on literally everything if the net result is a few more votes and approval from Dacre, Barclay, Murdoch.

I get it that Corbyn has principles and as a back bench MP, its easy to keep to those principles.

A leader is in a different position, especially if prime minister.

Sometimes you have to compromise, it's just part of the game they have to play.

Trouble for Corbyn is he just doesn't believe in his own party policy on trident. It's crazy to have an expensive deterrent policy in place if your leader won't use it and tells us he won't. It's like playing poker with your cards face up.

His principles (whilst admirable on a personal level) are part of the reason he will never be a leader.

I think it takes far greater leadership to say you would assess the options before committing yourself to blowing another country to bits.  

It's this british bulldog/little englander mentality I don't get, why does Britain need a nuclear deterrent?  

I think Paul Heaton summed it up well when he said "Lets just say when i look at the financial sector of the city of London, when I look at the baying politicians with their noses in the troughs of working class taxes i say to you. P.I.R.A couldn’t you reform for one last gig, it would be a blast."  
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« Reply #9177 on: June 03, 2017, 10:29:11 AM »

Seems incredible that we think he should compromise some of his principles to be more electable, literally the whole point is that he's spent his whole life with unshakeable principles that he believes are best for all people and that's what we on the left want in a politician. The alternative is people who will say or do literally anything to try and be electable. Their record suggests they'll change their mind on literally everything if the net result is a few more votes and approval from Dacre, Barclay, Murdoch.

I admire Corbyn for his principled stance on things but sometimes being able to comprise is key. I simply don't agree with stance on Nukes, it shows lack of awareness of why UK still has them ( a deterrent). The likely best possible outcome is a hung parliament and to get into number 10 he is going to have to compromise.

I still going to vote for him because despite his faults, because the alternative in my constituency is the Tories who have fought a truly awful campaign and appear to stand for very little apart from TM getting round a table with the EU.

As an aside and to show I am not truly bias. I went to the hustings in Croydon the other night and found my sitting MP Gavin Barwell (Tory) to be a far more credible politician than the labour challenger. He spoke well and even admitted the government had not done well enough regarding housing, I respect that.

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« Reply #9178 on: June 03, 2017, 11:13:55 AM »

Deterrent is one thing Longy but surely the end goal is a nuke free world?   

The biggest threat of an all out Nuke attack was during the cold war and in the end in simplistic terms both sides came to their senses. 

We waste absolute fortunes on maintaining and replacing Trident.  Moreover they are based in Scotland where the vast majority are anti-trident. 

The money wasted on a deterrent could be put so much better use. 

So long as we keep friendly relations with France and America we would be protected.  We can't actually let trident kick into action without the American's say so anyway. 

I think there are 9 countries at the moment with the capability to let one go if my Math is right 99.5% of countries in this world dont have Nukes.  Why do we want to be in that club of 0.5%

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« Reply #9179 on: June 03, 2017, 12:04:15 PM »

But Adz, the economists have come out and said the effect on the proposed migration cap is going to cost the UK £16bil a year until 2020, then £6bil a year thereafter. That cost will no doubt he borne further by the UK tax payer so that argument doesn't hold much stock. If your issue is just generally with people abusing the benefits system then that's one thing but cutting immigration is going to be net negative for the tax payer.

For those begging, how can you be sure they aren't British or are EU nationals? I live in Brighton, which has one of the worst homelessness problems in the UK, anecdotally it seems the majority are British.


This is my point that many miss. If people are bringing something that enhances our economy, or can do, they are welcome. It's the one that don't, I would refuse entry to.

I also didn't really suggest all beggars are immigrants either now, did I?! Angry
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