The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

Results are still coming in from across England, so this is essentially a half-time report. But the picture emerging is that Labour has gone backwards slightly from 2014, missed most of its targets (including all of them in London) and gained few seats. Opposition parties are supposed to do well in midterm contests, and these aren’t the results of one that’s about to storm the next general election.

https://www.ncpolitics.uk/2018/05/labour-comes-up-short.html/#more-3078

[MintTrav]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

[DungBeetle]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

You need ID for so many things these days.  Anyone who can’t bring the ID is stupid or lazy.  Why do you seem to imply that it is only the poor who are morons?  Surely this impacts f*ckwits of all standings?

[MintTrav]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

You need ID for so many things these days.  Anyone who can’t bring the ID is stupid or lazy.  Why do you seem to imply that it is only the poor who are morons?  Surely this impacts f*ckwits of all standings?

That isn't even where the argument is. There is a legitimate debate about whether everyone should carry ID, but whether the poor are disproportionately affected isn't in question. It is well-established from other countries that it is the poor who are affected by this. Check out Black disenfranchisement in the US for starters.

[kukushkin88]

political editor comment

It's the unflitered access to the leaders effect. Massive Labour bounce with unfiltered access to Corbyn.

[TightEnd]

political editor comment

It's the unflitered access to the leaders effect. Massive Labour bounce with unfiltered access to Corbyn.

speaking as someone who doesn't feel like he wants to vote for any of them (centrist remainer) I am far less sanguine than that

I think we (should) wave goodbye to any notion that Labour can "choose the future" by going after younger liberals. There isn't a path if you're giving up seats in places like Sunderland, Middlesbrough, Wigan, Bolton, Dudley, Wakefield, and Hull.

The assumption about "choose the future" is that the voters you choose are reliably in your column.

It's a really, really difficult exercise to manage this Labour coalition but choosing one side over another is clumsy, ill thought through and a bit of a cop out.

You have pro-remain big city left wingers (broadly, v pro Corbyn even though Corbyn is a leaver) and pro-leave working class labour heartlands who broadly don't vote for Corbyn

without both on the same page, tough to get a labour majority.

of course in 4 years things could look very different

[TightEnd]

on the same tack

Labour think they have lost Birmingham

won 80 of 101 seats in 2014

[AndrewT]

There was a tremendous interview with a UKIP spokesman on R4 Today earlier where he favourably compared UKIP to the Black Death.

The Black Death had many positive benefits - helped reduce servitude, opened the way for the Renaissance - you could almost hear Nick Robinson falling off his chair in surprise.

[nirvana]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

Could just try branding them in some way

[nirvana]

political editor comment

It's the unflitered access to the leaders effect. Massive Labour bounce with unfiltered access to Corbyn.

Labour need a new leader fairly quickly I'd say. Let's say this Parliament runs its course - he's gonna be an even older guy, trying to appeal to the yoot and it's hard to be some kind of 'new way' guy when you've been incumbent and making little impact for a number of years. I don't feel like I've heard much from Labour since the election that makes them more attractive to the electorate at large.. they go on with the pretence that we can have better services without paying more tax which vexes me.

The opposition element of what they do seems whimsical and based on protest politics (it was ever thus I guess) rather than some kind of 'new deal' proposals that might inspire a generation to confront the issues that won't go away -- aging pop, increasing pop from old people living too long and immigration, affordable housing, increasing health and social care demands, crumbling infrastructure, honesty and transparency around Brexit.

Time for Labour to stop pansying about and come up with something meaningful rather than just call the Tories out for not really beginning to rectify these fundamental problems.

[RickBFA]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

I'm sure I heard that voter turn out in these areas had increased since last comparable election?

[Doobs]

This isn't a good look.  This seems pretty brazen, even as politics goes.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/uk-politics-43998600

13:36

Conservatives gain Pendle after readmitting councillor
Pendle was under no overall control, with the Conservatives on 24 and Labour on 15.

However, the Tories have now managed to take Pendle by one seat after reinstating Councillor Rosemary Carroll who had been suspended for retweeting a racist joke.

[DungBeetle]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

You need ID for so many things these days.  Anyone who can’t bring the ID is stupid or lazy.  Why do you seem to imply that it is only the poor who are morons?  Surely this impacts f*ckwits of all standings?

That isn't even where the argument is. There is a legitimate debate about whether everyone should carry ID, but whether the poor are disproportionately affected isn't in question. It is well-established from other countries that it is the poor who are affected by this. Check out Black disenfranchisement in the US for starters.

Why does it impact anyone unless they are thick or lazy?  What person on the electoral role doesn’t have 2 items of a bank card/council tax letter/bank statement/driving licence/poll card/utility bill.  Idiocy doesn’t cut it I’m afraid.

[Woodsey]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

You need ID for so many things these days.  Anyone who can’t bring the ID is stupid or lazy.  Why do you seem to imply that it is only the poor who are morons?  Surely this impacts f*ckwits of all standings?

That isn't even where the argument is. There is a legitimate debate about whether everyone should carry ID, but whether the poor are disproportionately affected isn't in question. It is well-established from other countries that it is the poor who are affected by this. Check out Black disenfranchisement in the US for starters.

Why does it impact anyone unless they are thick or lazy?  What person on the electoral role doesn’t have 2 items of a bank card/council tax letter/bank statement/driving licence/poll card/utility bill.  Idiocy doesn’t cut it I’m afraid.

It’s always somebody else’s fault.....

[MintTrav]

In 2017, there were 28 cases of alleged in-person voter fraud throughout the whole country.

Yesterday, the government trialled voter ID in five Councils to deal with this non-existent problem. In very limited observations, Democracy Volunteers observed almost 2% of voters who attempted to vote being turned away for not having ID, not including those who turned around themselves when they saw signs spelling out the requirement or those who were put off from trying at all. One case of attempted personation was observed.

If the Conservatives are planning to impose voter ID throughout the country in order to suppress poorer people voting for other parties, the trial was a significant success.

https://democracyvolunteersdotorg.files.wordpress.com/2018/05/voter-id-pilot-areas-special-report-2018.pdf

You need ID for so many things these days.  Anyone who can’t bring the ID is stupid or lazy.  Why do you seem to imply that it is only the poor who are morons?  Surely this impacts f*ckwits of all standings?

That isn't even where the argument is. There is a legitimate debate about whether everyone should carry ID, but whether the poor are disproportionately affected isn't in question. It is well-established from other countries that it is the poor who are affected by this. Check out Black disenfranchisement in the US for starters.

Why does it impact anyone unless they are thick or lazy?  What person on the electoral role doesn’t have 2 items of a bank card/council tax letter/bank statement/driving licence/poll card/utility bill.  Idiocy doesn’t cut it I’m afraid.

It’s always somebody else’s fault.....

Yes, they are more disorganised/lazy/undeserving than us. Therefore they should not be allowed to vote?

You are concerned with how they should be. No doubt they should be better organised, etc, but we need to deal with how they are, not how they should be. These are people who have made the effort to go and vote, and we want to create artificial barriers to stop them from doing so. The fact is that there are people who don't have the documents. There are plenty who do but don't carry them, or forgot to bring them. Why should people have to go home again to get random documents and make a second journey? Or maybe not get to come back at all?

It is achieving nothing.  There is no problem with personation. It isn't even a sledgehammer to crack a nut, cos there is no nut. It is just a blatant attempt to prevent people from voting. In the absence of a personation problem, anyone who supports this restriction doesn't give two hoots about democracy and is only interested in improving the position of right-wing parties by underhand methods.