The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

Dominic Cummings told special advisers six times on Friday night that his job is to “deliver Brexit by October 31st by any means necessary”. See Sunday Times

[TightEnd]

Michael Gove tells the Sunday Times there is “now a very real prospect of no deal” and that Whitehall is being “retooled” to prepare. He will chair daily meetings of officials and give orders to ministers

Sunday times

[TightEnd]

YouGov for Sunday Times

Con 31 +6 since he took over
Lab 21 +2
LDem 20 -3
Brexit 13 -4

Highest Tory score since April
Biggest Tory lead since February

[TightEnd]

🗞 MAIL ON SUNDAY POLL 🗞

👦🏼 10 point Boris bounce 👦🏼

CON: 30 (+10)
LAB: 25 (-1)
LIB: 18 (+2)
BRX: 14 (-10)
CUK: 2 (-2)

-Deltapoll / Mail on Sunday

[TightEnd]

Opinium for Observer
Con 30% +7
Lab 28% +3
Lib Dem 16% +1
Brexit 15% -7
Green 5% -3
(Change since 2 weeks ago)

[TightEnd]

I can’t recall having seen any mention of Turkey joining the EU during the referendum campaign.

I’m not saying they didn’t happen, just that I don’t think I saw any.

I bet you remember the lie coming from key remainers about dire economic consequences and the need to have an emergency budget should leave win 

£60bn of quantitative easing in the two months after the referendum was instituted to mitigate against dire economic consequences, and removed the need for an emergency budget

As people don't understand what it is (printing money, buying gilts etc) and it wasn't publicised hugely (as people wouldn't understand what it is) the idea that the pre-ref prognostications are seen as a lie persists

It was and will always be case unproven

if we no deal they have £50bn earmarked to do the same

Consequences of the extra borrowing will be felt by people in the years ahead but will be necessary to avoid a nasty exogenous shock

 

[TightEnd]

Jonathan Powell concedes Johnson-Farage could win election landslide & calls for progressive coalition to stop them 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jul/27/boris-johnson-frighten-charm-eu

(sadly, unlikely, remain party co-operation very disorganised 3 years on)

[TightEnd]

The "Australian-style points system" for immigration is back. Reason for popularity: voters assume it means "whites only"

(link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3817675/Boris-Gove-s-great-Brexit-Vote-Leave-played-cynical-race-card-ploy-cash-fears-immigration-KNEW-Oz-style-points-wouldn-t-work-white-voters-liked-it.html)

[nirvana]

It's interesting the Cambridge Analytica stuff. I thought that documentary was really turgid for a notionally interesting story and nothing revelatory it seemed to me.

I'm sure I had a lot of my biases and prejudices confirmed/strengthened during the referendum (even if I don't remember ever clicking on any thick racist ct, click here links, perhaps it's the gardening stuff and corduroy trousers I buy online) Inevitable I guess given how well targeted a lot of the propaganda was.

I enjoyed it and it filled some gaps in my knowledge of the overall Cambridge Analytica story. I suspect I put more weight on the power of this stuff than you do.

Clearly you don't fall in the "persuadable" category   If you missed the ads here are a few  Vote Leave examples:

Just a  mix of anti-immigration tied in with a simple lie

Dominic Cummings thought the strategy was great though. He has confirmed Vote Leave dropped 1.5 billion ads to a target of 7 million voters in the last few days before the referendum.

On top of that you had  Farage and the Leave.EU ad campaign as well.

I definitely saw some of them as I have a few 'friends' who like to share stuff like this but didn't think we saw much new.

Remembered one thing that was a revelation and I found quite shocking was the 'Do so' campaign - think it was Trinidad.

[Woodsey]

I can’t recall having seen any mention of Turkey joining the EU during the referendum campaign.

I’m not saying they didn’t happen, just that I don’t think I saw any.

I bet you remember the lie coming from key remainers about dire economic consequences and the need to have an emergency budget should leave win 

£60bn of quantitative easing in the two months after the referendum was instituted to mitigate against dire economic consequences, and removed the need for an emergency budget

As people don't understand what it is (printing money, buying gilts etc) and it wasn't publicised hugely (as people wouldn't understand what it is) the idea that the pre-ref prognostications are seen as a lie persists

It was and will always be case unproven

if we no deal they have £50bn earmarked to do the same

Consequences of the extra borrowing will be felt by people in the years ahead but will be necessary to avoid a nasty exogenous shock

 

So it was a lie then 

[TightEnd]

I can’t recall having seen any mention of Turkey joining the EU during the referendum campaign.

I’m not saying they didn’t happen, just that I don’t think I saw any.

I bet you remember the lie coming from key remainers about dire economic consequences and the need to have an emergency budget should leave win 

£60bn of quantitative easing in the two months after the referendum was instituted to mitigate against dire economic consequences, and removed the need for an emergency budget

As people don't understand what it is (printing money, buying gilts etc) and it wasn't publicised hugely (as people wouldn't understand what it is) the idea that the pre-ref prognostications are seen as a lie persists

It was and will always be case unproven

if we no deal they have £50bn earmarked to do the same

Consequences of the extra borrowing will be felt by people in the years ahead but will be necessary to avoid a nasty exogenous shock

 

So it was a lie then 

No it wasn't. Pre-referendum an emergency budget was what Osborne was planning. Without the QE there would have been dire economic consequences. If we are out with no deal there will be 1 Nov onwards without another stimulus package

Mark Carney has done a sensational job, but is still derided by the fanatics as some sort of Jonah.

Please read what i wrote. disagree by all means but being obtuse is just frustrating

[MANTIS01]

The "Australian-style points system" for immigration is back. Reason for popularity: voters assume it means "whites only"

(link: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3817675/Boris-Gove-s-great-Brexit-Vote-Leave-played-cynical-race-card-ploy-cash-fears-immigration-KNEW-Oz-style-points-wouldn-t-work-white-voters-liked-it.html)

That's just horrible mate. Sounds like Gibbon's new book sucks ass.

For this to be effective and thus true we need to conclude the target audience is predominately racist. Truly horrible suggestion and undoubted lie.

The majority are in fact most familiar with the term Australian points system because the country has been a favourite Brit emigration destination for decades, it's perceived as peaceful, sunshine, beaches, friendly and most of all you only get in if suitably valuable to society. It addresses the concern over free movement very well and people understand the terminology. To cynically morph that into a "whites only" message is a big insult to the super tolerant, multi cultural folk in UK. What a gibbon!

[Woodsey]

I can’t recall having seen any mention of Turkey joining the EU during the referendum campaign.

I’m not saying they didn’t happen, just that I don’t think I saw any.

I bet you remember the lie coming from key remainers about dire economic consequences and the need to have an emergency budget should leave win 

£60bn of quantitative easing in the two months after the referendum was instituted to mitigate against dire economic consequences, and removed the need for an emergency budget

As people don't understand what it is (printing money, buying gilts etc) and it wasn't publicised hugely (as people wouldn't understand what it is) the idea that the pre-ref prognostications are seen as a lie persists

It was and will always be case unproven

if we no deal they have £50bn earmarked to do the same

Consequences of the extra borrowing will be felt by people in the years ahead but will be necessary to avoid a nasty exogenous shock

 

So it was a lie then 

No it wasn't. Pre-referendum an emergency budget was what Osborne was planning. Without the QE there would have been dire economic consequences. If we are out with no deal there will be 1 Nov onwards without another stimulus package

Mark Carney has done a sensational job, but is still derided by the fanatics as some sort of Jonah.

Please read what i wrote. disagree by all means but being obtuse is just frustrating

You are like a politician, trying to divert the conversation to suit you.

Sure Mark Carney took his own action, but the Osborne’s emergency budget did not happen so he lied, just admit it and move on FFS!

[TightEnd]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Gibbon

serious sensible journalist. his interpretation and the extract is his writing not mine

[TightEnd]

I can’t recall having seen any mention of Turkey joining the EU during the referendum campaign.

I’m not saying they didn’t happen, just that I don’t think I saw any.

I bet you remember the lie coming from key remainers about dire economic consequences and the need to have an emergency budget should leave win 

£60bn of quantitative easing in the two months after the referendum was instituted to mitigate against dire economic consequences, and removed the need for an emergency budget

As people don't understand what it is (printing money, buying gilts etc) and it wasn't publicised hugely (as people wouldn't understand what it is) the idea that the pre-ref prognostications are seen as a lie persists

It was and will always be case unproven

if we no deal they have £50bn earmarked to do the same

Consequences of the extra borrowing will be felt by people in the years ahead but will be necessary to avoid a nasty exogenous shock

 

So it was a lie then 

No it wasn't. Pre-referendum an emergency budget was what Osborne was planning. Without the QE there would have been dire economic consequences. If we are out with no deal there will be 1 Nov onwards without another stimulus package

Mark Carney has done a sensational job, but is still derided by the fanatics as some sort of Jonah.

Please read what i wrote. disagree by all means but being obtuse is just frustrating

You are like a politician, trying to divert the conversation to suit you.

Sure Mark Carney took his own action, but the Osborne’s emergency budget did not happen so he lied, just admit it and move on FFS!

no i am not diverting anything, continuing on my never ending and futile quest to get people like you to see through the fog and not take "it was a lie" at face value

i really will never learn that it is impossible :-)