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COVID19
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Topic: COVID19 (Read 354069 times)
Jon MW
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 6191
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2535 on:
May 26, 2020, 12:56:42 PM »
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 12:27:29 PM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 12:04:20 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 11:03:03 AM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 10:29:51 AM
I'm never keen on vox pops but I thought the answers in this thread give an interesting insight on how people from other countries are viewing the measures their governments are taking (nearly all of them are answering the question basically with - my one)
https://www.quora.com/What-country-has-the-most-insane-Coronavirus-strategy
Which only strengthens the argument for sticking to things that we can measure.
If we can avoid the temptation to try and stick things into league tables then a bit of broader knowledge of other countries might help give a more generalised perspective.
Left and Right echo chambers are easy to fall into, but the US/Europe echo chamber is very difficult to avoid.
Hearing what a few random Armenian/Indian/Argentians (etc) think can help increase your understanding of the world in a way that a random vox pop in your own country won't.
It reminds me of a book I read which used the same idea about literature, it was a book containing stories from writers from different countries to give an idea about their perspective on literature in their country. But I can't remember what the book was called so that's not too helpful a comparison I realise.
The international comparison tables aren’t going anywhere. It will be a unique opportunity in our lifetimes to identify what constitutes good governance.
Pokerpops will be along soon, to thank you for the fact that Quora polls with 25 responses, are now the gold standard for assessing government response to Coronavirus. He will also be delighted with the finding that they’re all the worst, by this measure.
good to see you're really taking to heart the message about learning about others and trying to grow as a person
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Jon "the British cowboy" Woodfield
2011 blonde MTT League August Champion
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5 Star HORSE Classic - 2007 Razz Champion
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kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2536 on:
May 26, 2020, 01:02:59 PM »
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 12:56:42 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 12:27:29 PM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 12:04:20 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 11:03:03 AM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 10:29:51 AM
I'm never keen on vox pops but I thought the answers in this thread give an interesting insight on how people from other countries are viewing the measures their governments are taking (nearly all of them are answering the question basically with - my one)
https://www.quora.com/What-country-has-the-most-insane-Coronavirus-strategy
Which only strengthens the argument for sticking to things that we can measure.
If we can avoid the temptation to try and stick things into league tables then a bit of broader knowledge of other countries might help give a more generalised perspective.
Left and Right echo chambers are easy to fall into, but the US/Europe echo chamber is very difficult to avoid.
Hearing what a few random Armenian/Indian/Argentians (etc) think can help increase your understanding of the world in a way that a random vox pop in your own country won't.
It reminds me of a book I read which used the same idea about literature, it was a book containing stories from writers from different countries to give an idea about their perspective on literature in their country. But I can't remember what the book was called so that's not too helpful a comparison I realise.
The international comparison tables aren’t going anywhere. It will be a unique opportunity in our lifetimes to identify what constitutes good governance.
Pokerpops will be along soon, to thank you for the fact that Quora polls with 25 responses, are now the gold standard for assessing government response to Coronavirus. He will also be delighted with the finding that they’re all the worst, by this measure.
good to see you're really taking to heart the message about learning about others and trying to grow as a person
I’m learning loads in the thread and in the crisis, don’t rush to judgement is my favourite lesson that I’ve learnt. Learning new stuff always suffers from recency bias but it feels like a great lesson at the moment.
Logged
Pokerpops
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 1423
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2537 on:
May 26, 2020, 03:04:54 PM »
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 01:02:59 PM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 12:56:42 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 12:27:29 PM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 12:04:20 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 11:03:03 AM
Quote from: Jon MW on May 26, 2020, 10:29:51 AM
I'm never keen on vox pops but I thought the answers in this thread give an interesting insight on how people from other countries are viewing the measures their governments are taking (nearly all of them are answering the question basically with - my one)
https://www.quora.com/What-country-has-the-most-insane-Coronavirus-strategy
Which only strengthens the argument for sticking to things that we can measure.
If we can avoid the temptation to try and stick things into league tables then a bit of broader knowledge of other countries might help give a more generalised perspective.
Left and Right echo chambers are easy to fall into, but the US/Europe echo chamber is very difficult to avoid.
Hearing what a few random Armenian/Indian/Argentians (etc) think can help increase your understanding of the world in a way that a random vox pop in your own country won't.
It reminds me of a book I read which used the same idea about literature, it was a book containing stories from writers from different countries to give an idea about their perspective on literature in their country. But I can't remember what the book was called so that's not too helpful a comparison I realise.
The international comparison tables aren’t going anywhere. It will be a unique opportunity in our lifetimes to identify what constitutes good governance.
Pokerpops will be along soon, to thank you for the fact that Quora polls with 25 responses, are now the gold standard for assessing government response to Coronavirus. He will also be delighted with the finding that they’re all the worst, by this measure.
good to see you're really taking to heart the message about learning about others and trying to grow as a person
I’m learning loads in the thread and in the crisis,
don’t rush to judgement is my favourite lesson that I’ve learnt
. Learning new stuff always suffers from recency bias but it feels like a great lesson at the moment.
I do hope so. It is a tremendous characteristic to have.
I accidentally opened a Quora page once, I won’t do that again.
Logged
"More than at any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness. The other, to total extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly."
kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2538 on:
May 26, 2020, 04:11:03 PM »
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 08:57:50 AM
Quote from: Cf on May 26, 2020, 08:42:35 AM
Looks like him saying "I've been warning about coronavirus for a while" could have been a fabrication too.
https://t.co/g8ZMPo4GUJ
This goes beyond party politics. We are in the middle of a pandemic. We objectively have one of the worst responses to it in the world. And the people at the very top are lying to us live on television. How is this acceptable?
In terms of the Civil Service Code of Conduct, it’s quite unbelievable that he used that platform to brag about his genius in foreseeing this. Incredible that he thought he’d get something so clearly untrue through, to an audience of millions.
It’s quite extraordinary:
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-52808059
How do you get to be as old
and Cummings and not realise that if you lie about practically everything, it will f*** you over in the end?
Also pleasing that Cummings (the great intellect lol) is now our Trump. The US doctors had to ‘say don’t drink disinfectant’, now, because of him, our police/doctors/optometrists have to say ‘don’t drive your car 60 miles on windy roads to test your eye sight.’
Logged
kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2539 on:
May 26, 2020, 04:27:39 PM »
Must be the stir craziness and loneliness of lockdown but I think I have fallen in love with Marina Hyde, based almost exclusively on her contributions to Twitter 😂.
Another great article:
https://twitter.com/marinahyde/status/1265273172347281414?s=21
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superwomble
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2728
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2540 on:
May 26, 2020, 04:36:32 PM »
https://twitter.com/k8_lister/status/1265243287327256577
Seems a good summary of the events, highlighting some of the many unanswered questions raised by Cummings' supposedly fine tale.
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kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2541 on:
May 26, 2020, 04:55:27 PM »
Seems a good move from David Lammy, asking the Lord Chancellor (a man of some integrity imo) to confirm that as long you or your spouse has Coronavirus, you can go wherever you like:
https://twitter.com/davidlammy/status/1265291894763945991?s=21
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kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2542 on:
May 26, 2020, 05:58:45 PM »
According to the people who would know, they really have screwed up here:
https://twitter.com/barristersecret/status/1265324890233675776?s=21
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TightEnd
Administrator
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: I am a geek!!
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2543 on:
May 26, 2020, 06:20:46 PM »
Dr Luke Evans MP
To:rich.prew@xxxx
Tue 26 May at 18:04
Hello,
Many thanks for your email over the bank holiday weekend about Dominic Cummings.
I have had an unprecedented number of emails on this topic. Some of the emails are standardised campaign emails but many are personal ones which constituents have taken a great deal of time and consideration to express their concern, anger and disappointment. Sadly I don’t have the time to write individually to everyone who has contacted me about Mr Cummings. This email is a standard reply but please be assured I have personally read all emails and in many cases shared the views that you have expressed.
I get it.
I understand why there is sadness, anger, frustration and concern.
As an MP and as a Doctor I understand that together the vast majority of us have observed the lockdown rules. We have stuck to the guidance and even in doing so some of us have suffered the heartbreak of losing loved ones or friends.
I don’t have all the facts and so have therefore not commented publicly and don’t feel comfortable in doing so, but as you have written to me for my opinion, I am happy to write this to you.
The lock down rules are there for everyone, with no exemptions.
The punishment for breaking such rules are also there for everyone, no exemptions.
A trial by media helps no one. Social distancing applies to everyone, no exemptions.
So, given the concerns and strength of feeling that you and many others have expressed to me I will be writing to the Prime Minister in the next 24 hours to raise your concerns and seek reassurances that they will be acted upon.
Many thanks again for your email,
Dr Luke Evans MP | Member of Parliament for Bosworth
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Pokerpops
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 1423
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2544 on:
May 26, 2020, 06:48:37 PM »
Quote from: TightEnd on May 26, 2020, 06:20:46 PM
Dr Luke Evans MP
To:rich.prew@xxxx
Tue 26 May at 18:04
Hello,
Many thanks for your email over the bank holiday weekend about Dominic Cummings.
I have had an unprecedented number of emails on this topic. Some of the emails are standardised campaign emails but many are personal ones which constituents have taken a great deal of time and consideration to express their concern, anger and disappointment. Sadly I don’t have the time to write individually to everyone who has contacted me about Mr Cummings. This email is a standard reply but please be assured I have personally read all emails and in many cases shared the views that you have expressed.
I get it.
I understand why there is sadness, anger, frustration and concern.
As an MP and as a Doctor I understand that together the vast majority of us have observed the lockdown rules. We have stuck to the guidance and even in doing so some of us have suffered the heartbreak of losing loved ones or friends.
I don’t have all the facts and so have therefore not commented publicly and don’t feel comfortable in doing so, but as you have written to me for my opinion, I am happy to write this to you.
The lock down rules are there for everyone, with no exemptions.
The punishment for breaking such rules are also there for everyone, no exemptions.
A trial by media helps no one. Social distancing applies to everyone, no exemptions.
So, given the concerns and strength of feeling that you and many others have expressed to me I will be writing to the Prime Minister in the next 24 hours to raise your concerns and seek reassurances that they will be acted upon.
Many thanks again for your email,
Dr Luke Evans MP | Member of Parliament for Bosworth
“A trial by media helps no one.”
Logged
"More than at any other time in history, mankind faces a crossroads. One path leads to despair and utter hopelessness. The other, to total extinction. Let us pray we have the wisdom to choose correctly."
Cf
Global Moderator
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 8089
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2545 on:
May 26, 2020, 07:55:54 PM »
Quote from: Pokerpops on May 26, 2020, 06:48:37 PM
Quote from: TightEnd on May 26, 2020, 06:20:46 PM
Dr Luke Evans MP
To:rich.prew@xxxx
Tue 26 May at 18:04
Hello,
Many thanks for your email over the bank holiday weekend about Dominic Cummings.
I have had an unprecedented number of emails on this topic. Some of the emails are standardised campaign emails but many are personal ones which constituents have taken a great deal of time and consideration to express their concern, anger and disappointment. Sadly I don’t have the time to write individually to everyone who has contacted me about Mr Cummings. This email is a standard reply but please be assured I have personally read all emails and in many cases shared the views that you have expressed.
I get it.
I understand why there is sadness, anger, frustration and concern.
As an MP and as a Doctor I understand that together the vast majority of us have observed the lockdown rules. We have stuck to the guidance and even in doing so some of us have suffered the heartbreak of losing loved ones or friends.
I don’t have all the facts and so have therefore not commented publicly and don’t feel comfortable in doing so, but as you have written to me for my opinion, I am happy to write this to you.
The lock down rules are there for everyone, with no exemptions.
The punishment for breaking such rules are also there for everyone, no exemptions.
A trial by media helps no one. Social distancing applies to everyone, no exemptions.
So, given the concerns and strength of feeling that you and many others have expressed to me I will be writing to the Prime Minister in the next 24 hours to raise your concerns and seek reassurances that they will be acted upon.
Many thanks again for your email,
Dr Luke Evans MP | Member of Parliament for Bosworth
“A trial by media helps no one.”
Trial by media? What trial by media. The media have every right to ask questions of one of the most powerful men in the country. Especially when what is being said is demonstrably false. Or what? We just keep our mouths shut and let them do what they like?
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Blue text
Doobs
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 16570
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2546 on:
May 26, 2020, 08:21:40 PM »
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 05:58:45 PM
According to the people who would know, they really have screwed up here:
https://twitter.com/barristersecret/status/1265324890233675776?s=21
There are some gems on his account
The Secret Barrister
@BarristerSecret
·
If I’m worried about my vision, driving a car containing my family for 30 miles is a bold choice of eye test.
The Secret Barrister
@BarristerSecret
A good lawyer would have advised a client that if you’re minded to give a defence which is (a) incredible; and (b) if true, an admission of guilt, you should not go into the witness box.
Absolute legal scenes.
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Most of the bets placed so far seem more like hopeful punts rather than value spots
kukushkin88
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 3892
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2547 on:
May 26, 2020, 08:35:56 PM »
Quote from: Doobs on May 26, 2020, 08:21:40 PM
Quote from: kukushkin88 on May 26, 2020, 05:58:45 PM
According to the people who would know, they really have screwed up here:
https://twitter.com/barristersecret/status/1265324890233675776?s=21
There are some gems on his account
The Secret Barrister
@BarristerSecret
·
If I’m worried about my vision, driving a car containing my family for 30 miles is a bold choice of eye test.
The Secret Barrister
@BarristerSecret
A good lawyer would have advised a client that if you’re minded to give a defence which is (a) incredible; and (b) if true, an admission of guilt, you should not go into the witness box.
Absolute legal scenes.
It’s been great watching it through the perspective of experienced barristers. David Allen Green is the same, clearly one of the good guys, so knowledgeable, with a sense of humour and just a hint of mischief.
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The Camel
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 17523
Under my tree, being a troll.
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2548 on:
May 26, 2020, 11:14:27 PM »
Lewis Goodall on NN cut through all the bullshit.
If his wife had COVID symptoms they should not have travelled.
If she did not have COVID symptoms there were no exceptional circumstances.
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RickBFA
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2001
Re: COVID19
«
Reply #2549 on:
May 26, 2020, 11:42:52 PM »
Quote from: The Camel on May 26, 2020, 11:14:27 PM
Lewis Goodall on NN cut through all the bullshit.
If his wife had COVID symptoms they should not have travelled.
If she did not have COVID symptoms there were no exceptional circumstances.
I think it easy to get very tribal about stuff like this especially as this is Cummings.
I can see the logical of protecting the welfare of a 4 year old child. Given the guidance does give everyone the leeway to deal with that situation, I think the isolation in Durham is actually reasonable. Everyone does have the option to do what Cummings did - it just happens we dont tend to have an empty property on our parents estate to use (but that’s just his good fortune).
It’s the trip to Barnard Castle which is the bit that looks irresponsible. That’s the killer for him along with the negative PR for his Government and the damage to the lockdown.
The combination of those last points is why he should resign for me.
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