The UK Politics and EU Referendum thread - merged

[TightEnd]

after Ken Clarke's barnstorming contribution yesterday

Only moderate Tories can prevent a rock-hard Brexit. They must rebel

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/31/tory-moderates-must-rebel-rock-hard-brexit-pro-trump-alignment?CMP=twt_gu

[TightEnd]

The Guardian view on Trump and Brexit: Britain faces the worst of both worlds | Editorial

(trying to out-manouevre UKIP damages the UK national interest etc)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/31/the-guardian-view-on-trump-and-brexit-britain-faces-the-worst-of-both-worlds?CMP=twt_gu

[TightEnd]

Blocking Article 50 risks larger Tory majority at snap election – Labour shadow Brexit minister http://bit.ly/2kPGVzn

hence they aren't going to

[RickBFA]

Nicci Sturge having a little moan today that May isn't taking Scotland seriously. No love, it's probably more personal than that

Jimmy Krankie can moan all she likes, I guess the point is May is taking the UK as a whole seriously. Cant have one small part of the UK trying to dictate to the majority.

Her threats are meaningless nonsense.

rofl I've already said she doesn't care what anyone south of the border thinks and she positively relishes trolling English brexiters like you two.

Glad we can make you smile.

You don't have to be a brexiter to dislike her and her distorted view of democracy.

She gets an unbelievably easy ride.

The Scottish people will wise up eventually.

How so?  She is a far better leader than any of the other devolved parliaments can offer up.  She's a better leader than the neglected prime minister and can actually think in her feet. 

Your little wngkander mentality doesn't allow you to see through your own bigotry of course.

How so?

It's about the will of the U.K. as a whole.

The U.K. that the Scottish people voted to be part of.

Common sense.

Nothing to do with little englander or bigotry. Pretty pathetic comments.

What about the hundreds of thousands who voted in the Scottish referendum for staying part of the UK under the assurance it was the only way they could continue to be part of the EU? 

They were sold a dummy.

That argument makes no sense.

The Tories announced the policy of an EU referendum in January 2013, long before the vote took place on Scottish independence.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-21148282

So the Scottish people voted to stay part of UK - and all that brings - with the full knowledge a vote on EU was a strong possibility and definitely Tory policy.

If you believe in our democracy and the will of the people of the UK as a whole, you can see the SNP position is a joke.

[doubleup]

Nicci Sturge having a little moan today that May isn't taking Scotland seriously. No love, it's probably more personal than that

Jimmy Krankie can moan all she likes, I guess the point is May is taking the UK as a whole seriously. Cant have one small part of the UK trying to dictate to the majority.

Her threats are meaningless nonsense.

rofl I've already said she doesn't care what anyone south of the border thinks and she positively relishes trolling English brexiters like you two.

Glad we can make you smile.

You don't have to be a brexiter to dislike her and her distorted view of democracy.

She gets an unbelievably easy ride.

The Scottish people will wise up eventually.

How so?  She is a far better leader than any of the other devolved parliaments can offer up.  She's a better leader than the neglected prime minister and can actually think in her feet. 

Your little wngkander mentality doesn't allow you to see through your own bigotry of course.

How so?

It's about the will of the U.K. as a whole.

The U.K. that the Scottish people voted to be part of.

Common sense.

Nothing to do with little englander or bigotry. Pretty pathetic comments.

What about the hundreds of thousands who voted in the Scottish referendum for staying part of the UK under the assurance it was the only way they could continue to be part of the EU? 

They were sold a dummy.

That argument makes no sense.

The Tories announced the policy of an EU referendum in January 2013, long before the vote took place on Scottish independence.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-21148282

So the Scottish people voted to stay part of UK - and all that brings - with the full knowledge a vote on EU was a strong possibility and definitely Tory policy.

If you believe in our democracy and the will of the people of the UK as a whole, you can see the SNP position is a joke.

The "No" campaign made huge capital from saying that an independent Scotland would no longer be in the EU and would have to apply to join.  This and Darling/Osborne stating that they would refuse to let Scotland use the £ were the two biggest negatives in the independence campaign as the SNP provided no credible counter arguments and just tried to bluster.

That one statement from Darling standing side by side with an austerity Tory was probably more important than anything in destroying Labour in Scotland.

[RickBFA]

Nicci Sturge having a little moan today that May isn't taking Scotland seriously. No love, it's probably more personal than that

Jimmy Krankie can moan all she likes, I guess the point is May is taking the UK as a whole seriously. Cant have one small part of the UK trying to dictate to the majority.

Her threats are meaningless nonsense.

rofl I've already said she doesn't care what anyone south of the border thinks and she positively relishes trolling English brexiters like you two.

Glad we can make you smile.

You don't have to be a brexiter to dislike her and her distorted view of democracy.

She gets an unbelievably easy ride.

The Scottish people will wise up eventually.

How so?  She is a far better leader than any of the other devolved parliaments can offer up.  She's a better leader than the neglected prime minister and can actually think in her feet. 

Your little wngkander mentality doesn't allow you to see through your own bigotry of course.

How so?

It's about the will of the U.K. as a whole.

The U.K. that the Scottish people voted to be part of.

Common sense.

Nothing to do with little englander or bigotry. Pretty pathetic comments.

What about the hundreds of thousands who voted in the Scottish referendum for staying part of the UK under the assurance it was the only way they could continue to be part of the EU? 

They were sold a dummy.

That argument makes no sense.

The Tories announced the policy of an EU referendum in January 2013, long before the vote took place on Scottish independence.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-21148282

So the Scottish people voted to stay part of UK - and all that brings - with the full knowledge a vote on EU was a strong possibility and definitely Tory policy.

If you believe in our democracy and the will of the people of the UK as a whole, you can see the SNP position is a joke.

The "No" campaign made huge capital from saying that an independent Scotland would no longer be in the EU and would have to apply to join.  This and Darling/Osborne stating that they would refuse to let Scotland use the £ were the two biggest negatives in the independence campaign as the SNP provided no credible counter arguments and just tried to bluster.

That one statement from Darling standing side by side with an austerity Tory was probably more important than anything in destroying Labour in Scotland.

That may have been the case, but the Scottish people still knew if they voted to stay in UK there was a possibility we would exit the EU. It was well documented - they accepted this risk as part of their decision to stay in the UK.

Ultimately, when part of the UK, in this situation, different parts cant pick and choose what suits them, that's the road to anarchy.

This for me is a fundamental part of UK democracy. The majority voted for it.

[TightEnd]

European Parliament today

Farage speaks in support of President Wotsit

:-)

Click to see full-size image.

[Doobs]

European Parliament today

Farage speaks in support of President Wotsit

:-)

Click to see full-size image.

Defending his fellow member of the establishment.

[TightEnd]

Sir Ivan Rogers confirms numbers in this story - Commission has been talking about a €40-60 billion divorce bill

http://news.sky.com/story/uk-faces-brexit-settlement-bill-of-up-to-16350bn-sky-sources-say-10697402

[TightEnd]

Brexit talks will descend into fist-fighting, warns Sir Ivan Rogers

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/feb/01/brexit-talks-eu-fist-fighting-sir-ivan-rogers?CMP=twt_gu

[TightEnd]

roughly a quarter of Labour MPs rebelled against Jeremy Corbyn's order for them to back the Govt's Brexit bill. (47-149)

a further 11 did not vote, including Dianne Abbott

on R4 this morning McDonnell then claimed that none of the front bench rebels would be sacked, so therefore the three line whip didn't mean a lot

[TightEnd]

Quick post on Labour's next leadership race and Article 50:

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/staggers/2017/02/labours-next-leadership-election-will-be-about-europe-dont-bet-clive-lewis

7,000 people have left the Labour party over Article 50 in the past week

 Long-Bailey is now the preferred successor as far as the leadership is concerned

[TightEnd]

ANALYSIS: How Team Corbyn could respond if Clive Lewis quits the Shadow Cabinet http://bit.ly/2kfVcqc

[TightEnd]

the 47 who voted against all in big remain areas

Click to see full-size image.

[TightEnd]

Labour Article 50 rebellion: 2 shadow cabinet, 10 junior shadow ministers, three whips.