Issues Arising from Staking

[SuuPRlim]

Micheal is a really good guy, and he's giving something to blonde right now so if he wants to stick a staking thread up on post 301 go ahead, takes a bit more time round these streets though to gain credibility but he'll soon get all that.

Very high chance by October he'll have 1000 posts and only a few staking threads, with the current quality of posting I don't think anyone could argue that will have been decent for the forum...

Could prolly have been a little more subtle about it mind Mike

[SuuPRlim]

I still find the notion of buying back action weird. You need to funk for your horse to run bad up until the ME starts and then funk they run like the wind from that moment forward. If it turns out your horse is binking comps and bang in form before hand, well you and your stake are sacked off. I don't really see the community spirit in that arrangement. Backing a horse in some massive luckbox donkathon isn't really 'investing in a profitable business opportunity', it's buying a lottery ticket. Think the buyer is taking a lot of risk and at the same time facilitating the horse's entrance to a major comp. It also seems more common to not be paid or to be paid late these days or for horses to say if they had a heavy night the stake is sacked off. So think there is an overall lack of respect for the buyer.

However, there is still value to be found, people can still buy action in major TV star Tony 'Tikay' Kendall, with no mark up, great trip reports, no risk of being unpaid or late paid, very humble respectful attitude, lots of community spirit, and significant commercial revenues from sky for wearing patches when he hits the FT. These are all the reasons why buyers would invest in a wsop lottery ticket imo, not because it is marginally +EV on paper.

I'm happy to say Mantis I agree with (most) of this.

The buy-back thing is meh, I'd like to see the stipulation that it's bought back with a mark-up, i.e you pay $150 for a % and reserve the right to purchase it back for $180 - gtd'd 20% return seems like a good deal if the guy suddenly decides he wants all the action himsef...

[The Camel]

Micheal is a really good guy, and he's giving something to blonde right now so if he wants to stick a staking thread up on post 301 go ahead, takes a bit more time round these streets though to gain credibility but he'll soon get all that.

Very high chance by October he'll have 1000 posts and only a few staking threads, with the current quality of posting I don't think anyone could argue that will have been decent for the forum...

Could prolly have been a little more subtle about it mind Mike

That's the thing.

The vast majority of blondes don't *know* he's a good guy.

It takes longer than 2 weeks to discover that.

All we can see is him tearing around racing to 300 posts as quickly as possible.

We do know for a fact Ironside is a fantastic bloke and we knew how much it would mean to him to play with Hellmuth, Matusow and #teamdannyboy. That's why he got staked.

[The Camel]

I still find the notion of buying back action weird. You need to funk for your horse to run bad up until the ME starts and then funk they run like the wind from that moment forward. If it turns out your horse is binking comps and bang in form before hand, well you and your stake are sacked off. I don't really see the community spirit in that arrangement. Backing a horse in some massive luckbox donkathon isn't really 'investing in a profitable business opportunity', it's buying a lottery ticket. Think the buyer is taking a lot of risk and at the same time facilitating the horse's entrance to a major comp. It also seems more common to not be paid or to be paid late these days or for horses to say if they had a heavy night the stake is sacked off. So think there is an overall lack of respect for the buyer.

However, there is still value to be found, people can still buy action in major TV star Tony 'Tikay' Kendall, with no mark up, great trip reports, no risk of being unpaid or late paid, very humble respectful attitude, lots of community spirit, and significant commercial revenues from sky for wearing patches when he hits the FT. These are all the reasons why buyers would invest in a wsop lottery ticket imo, not because it is marginally +EV on paper.

I'm happy to say Mantis I agree with (most) of this.

The buy-back thing is meh, I'd like to see the stipulation that it's bought back with a mark-up, i.e you pay $150 for a % and reserve the right to purchase it back for $180 - gtd'd 20% return seems like a good deal if the guy suddenly decides he wants all the action himsef...

Bingo!

That's a great idea.

You're not just a pretty face.

[redsimon]

All I know regarding the guy trying his best to get to 300 posts is I'll be snap not buying even at 1.00

[cambridgealex]

I said I'd give all backers a freeroll in the main should I bink and buy the action back.

ftr i never would have thought of doing it had Brammer not done it last year. And I know Brammer is a thoroughly good bloke, with plenty of respect in the community and respect for his backers/buyers, and it was accepted by most last year so went for it myself.

I do honestly see where everyone who doesn't like it is coming from though.

[wazz]

But will these contributions stop abruptly when 300 is reached and the inevitable staking thread goes up?

They won't stop but there's obviously no way I can prove this ahead of time and without you knowing me there's no reason for you to think this so I can completely understand your attitude.

I'm in a bit of a bind regarding this action-selling thing. I'm fairly sure I represent good value to a staker but I do need to sell to be able to play the entire package. I haven't been able to sell much on 2+2, but I don't think that's about the value I represent, but rather the state of the marketplace over there. I have a couple of potential buyers who I expect will throw in 10% each or thereabouts, but I'd rather just get all the investment in place so I can stop worrying.

If I'd posted my schedule a few weeks earlier I surely would have been able to sell out at a higher markup but most people have spent their budget. Unfortunately I had a living arrangement that was massively up in the air (broke up with girlfriend who I was living with) that meant I couldn't book Vegas before I had that sorted.

Yes, it's fairly transparent what I'm doing and you could say cynical (I wouldn't), but I've been open and honest about it from the start. I'm not gonna ditch the community as soon as the WSOP is over.

I guess I am asking for some goodwill, and I'm well-aware that respect has to be earned rather than given, which is why I've made a point of taking some time over every post, trying to be helpful, and not making any silly, obvious, cynical one-liner posts. That would be taking the piss, and I never came to blonde thinking 'I'll take the piss out of them and then they'll desperately want to buy my product!'

When we play hands of poker we're playing for the long term and I try to approach everything else in poker that way.

[outragous76]

But the ONLY reason you started posting on blonde recently was to try and sell your action, and pretty much brcause you didn't sell on 2p2.

So yes, your contributions have been good, but it will be very interesting to see the interest in your  inevitable staking thread.

Tbf, my post in the staking thread was half (un)funny, and half to see if people would post any genuine interest for you

[Simon Galloway]

The takeup on 2+2 is probably reduced for a couple of reasons.  First up, there are pages and pages of people selling action, so to that extent, it is a buyer's market and there should be a downward pressure on markup.  I notice that already has caused you to restructure your package.  Secondly, I assume many are wary of SanRemoGate, where altho you have since admitted wrongdoing, your actions throughout that were beyond blinkered and selfish - to say you were out to max your own return on it would be an understatement.

[The Camel]

But will these contributions stop abruptly when 300 is reached and the inevitable staking thread goes up?

They won't stop but there's obviously no way I can prove this ahead of time and without you knowing me there's no reason for you to think this so I can completely understand your attitude.

I'm in a bit of a bind regarding this action-selling thing. I'm fairly sure I represent good value to a staker but I do need to sell to be able to play the entire package. I haven't been able to sell much on 2+2, but I don't think that's about the value I represent, but rather the state of the marketplace over there. I have a couple of potential buyers who I expect will throw in 10% each or thereabouts, but I'd rather just get all the investment in place so I can stop worrying.

If I'd posted my schedule a few weeks earlier I surely would have been able to sell out at a higher markup but most people have spent their budget. Unfortunately I had a living arrangement that was massively up in the air (broke up with girlfriend who I was living with) that meant I couldn't book Vegas before I had that sorted.

Yes, it's fairly transparent what I'm doing and you could say cynical (I wouldn't), but I've been open and honest about it from the start. I'm not gonna ditch the community as soon as the WSOP is over.

I guess I am asking for some goodwill, and I'm well-aware that respect has to be earned rather than given, which is why I've made a point of taking some time over every post, trying to be helpful, and not making any silly, obvious, cynical one-liner posts. That would be taking the piss, and I never came to blonde thinking 'I'll take the piss out of them and then they'll desperately want to buy my product!'

When we play hands of poker we're playing for the long term and I try to approach everything else in poker that way.

You can see why veteran blondes might feel a little used by your tactics though.

[wazz]

You can see why veteran blondes might feel a little used by your tactics though.

Completely and this is why I won't be shocked if I don't sell anything at all here, but I do have to try.

The takeup on 2+2 is probably reduced for a couple of reasons.  First up, there are pages and pages of people selling action, so to that extent, it is a buyer's market and there should be a downward pressure on markup.  I notice that already has caused you to restructure your package.  Secondly, I assume many are wary of SanRemoGate, where altho you have since admitted wrongdoing, your actions throughout that were beyond blinkered and selfish - to say you were out to max your own return on it would be an understatement.

The first part is true. Regarding the second part I have sold a few packages successfully and with no issues since San Remo, and I believe most in 2p2 would believe my reputation to be close to fully rehabilitated.

But the ONLY reason you started posting on blonde recently was to try and sell your action, and pretty much brcause you didn't sell on 2p2.

So yes, your contributions have been good, but it will be very interesting to see the interest in your  inevitable staking thread.

Tbf, my post in the staking thread was half (un)funny, and half to see if people would post any genuine interest for you

It's not the only reason, Stu has been encouraging me to post here for a while.

If I don't get much action sold over here it won't be a shock to me but I've got to try. Hopefully by the point I've got to 300 posts I will have shown myself to be a good player, thoughtful and ready to be a member of the community.

[titaniumbean]

man give wazzz a break it's not like he's posting 300 lols all over the shop.

[The Camel]

man give wazzz a break it's not like he's posting 300 lols all over the shop.

This is very true.

I guess the marketplace will be the ultimate judge and jury

[tikay]

But will these contributions stop abruptly when 300 is reached and the inevitable staking thread goes up?

They won't stop but there's obviously no way I can prove this ahead of time and without you knowing me there's no reason for you to think this so I can completely understand your attitude.

I'm in a bit of a bind regarding this action-selling thing. I'm fairly sure I represent good value to a staker but I do need to sell to be able to play the entire package. I haven't been able to sell much on 2+2, but I don't think that's about the value I represent, but rather the state of the marketplace over there. I have a couple of potential buyers who I expect will throw in 10% each or thereabouts, but I'd rather just get all the investment in place so I can stop worrying.

If I'd posted my schedule a few weeks earlier I surely would have been able to sell out at a higher markup but most people have spent their budget. Unfortunately I had a living arrangement that was massively up in the air (broke up with girlfriend who I was living with) that meant I couldn't book Vegas before I had that sorted.

Yes, it's fairly transparent what I'm doing and you could say cynical (I wouldn't), but I've been open and honest about it from the start. I'm not gonna ditch the community as soon as the WSOP is over.

I guess I am asking for some goodwill, and I'm well-aware that respect has to be earned rather than given, which is why I've made a point of taking some time over every post, trying to be helpful, and not making any silly, obvious, cynical one-liner posts. That would be taking the piss, and I never came to blonde thinking 'I'll take the piss out of them and then they'll desperately want to buy my product!'

When we play hands of poker we're playing for the long term and I try to approach everything else in poker that way.

Hello Mr Wazz.

I don't actually have a clue who you are (nor you me, I expect) but that matters not.

The enboldened part is very important.

We have had folks just dashing round the place sticking up daft one-liners. This is disrespectful to the OP's of those threads (it destroys the flow), & to the Community, because every man & his dog sees through it. So we are very grateful that you are being sensible & constructive with the Post Race.

In the case of those who do the daft one-liners, we simply keep re-setting their Post Count back to zero, until they get the point. We will not do that with you, for the reasons stated in the prev para, but it does grate a little to wake up every morning to all those Posts!

Really, it is a fault of the system we use, the 300 Post thing.

There are lots of critics of the 300 Post system, & they make fair points, but there are just as many critics of whatever system we can try. Bit awkward striking the correct balance, really.

Most important is that the Community gets the chance to get some feel for those who want staking, as to trust, & character, & that takes time, & Posts. This is NOT 2+2, (thank God).

I understand the whole thing, & appreciate your position. Whatever happens, I wish you a succesful Vegas 2013.

Incidentally, I have been a major staker (buyer) on blonde for some years now, but not this year. The market on blonde is a bit frothy, & in need of some correction. It will correct itself in due course, that is how markets work. The rates are self-policing, it is that simple.

[outragous76]

man give wazzz a break it's not like he's posting 300 lols all over the shop.

I honestly have absolutely no problem with wazz, we have had several good debates in PHA,  but to say its not the only reason he started posting is simply  disingenuous at best, given the has previously admitted it is!