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Arsenal FC a very promising story
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Topic: Arsenal FC a very promising story (Read 600566 times)
maldini32
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Posts: 3356
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3075 on:
September 04, 2017, 07:04:49 PM »
Quote from: 77dave on September 04, 2017, 02:38:05 PM
Maybe there are other reasons the Liverpool thread got no posts after a 4-0 win
Reasons why some of blondes oldest members don't post on the forum anymore but let's ignore all that
Personally I'm really happy with the signing of the OX
Pretty much this
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Archer
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Posts: 1053
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad story
«
Reply #3076 on:
September 04, 2017, 07:36:45 PM »
Quote from: tikay on September 04, 2017, 05:55:15 PM
Quote from: BigAdz on September 04, 2017, 01:10:29 PM
Quote from: tikay on September 04, 2017, 11:30:02 AM
Quote from: tikay on August 25, 2017, 09:26:46 AM
Arsenal are great for the blonde post count - one unlucky defeat, in a game they utterly dominated, & it generated 3 pages of posts. Over in North London, Spurs got turned over at home & it barely generated comment, then the Man City team, which cost sixty squillion dropped a point at home to Everton & barely a word is said.
Arsenal play Liverpool on Sunday. Lose that, & blonde will have a record month for post count.
Win win.
Well maybe not a "record month", but the second consecutive defeat generated over 150 posts. The defeat to Stoke, as most neutrals would attest, was a game Arsenal dominated, the defeat to Liverpool was a real shocker, no excuses. So, whatever way we look at it, 2 consecutive defeats. They are home to Bournemouth next, lose that & blonde will explode.
Amazing how we love to finger point & celebrate failure, but ignore success. We are selective, too. Man City lost two on the bounce last December (1 of which was at home) & nobody said a word, the media was not full of "OMG, OMG, CRISIS" stuff. The Man City boys are very noisy right now over Sanchez, of course. Why? Because, for once, waving their fat chequebook failed. They are not used to that.
A 4-0 defeat generated 150 posts on the Arsenal thread, but the 4-0 win did not get a single mention on the Liverpool thread. There's a thing. It seems we really do prefer to celebrate failure, & follow the media hype.
Lets be honest. this is a load of old bollocks.
Firstly. I don't give a shit about the other teams threads, I rarely visit them, as i don't watch them and understand the nuances and issues they have. It is up to them what they moan about or celebrate
Your post refers to this thread, and i/we have celebrated several victories, most notablly the FA Cup win last season. So that's that one put to bed.
We covered our spectacular run at the end of last season, the same as the last few seasons, when all the main business has been sorted and we take advantage of everyone else being on auto pilot and try to salvage another wasted set of opportunities in the managerial merry go round.
You never seem to address the more stuble stuff Tikay, like, as GC said, and I said a while back.
Why does he leave Lacazette on the bench?
Why make stupid bids that are accepted, then pull out.
Why say someone is not for sale under any circs and then sell them
Why does he let all our top boys contracts run out so their value to us is now zero in the Xfer market, when for years it all been about making money.
Come on old chap, stop having a pop at those of us with lucid reasons for being "haters" and put us right......this isn't knee jerk for some of us, we have been saying the same thing for years, much like the results...
The floor is all yours.
"load of old bollocks"? If you wish. It was my genuine opinion actually, & I hoped we could debate constructively.
"Why does he leave Lacazette on the bench?"
I don't have the faintest idea. Chances are, as AW is an experienced Premier League Manager, & arguably a very good one in his prime,
he had good reason
. Think it would not be sensible to suggest that we, sitting in our nice comfy armchair in front of the telly, & in our ignorance of the facts & reasons, know better than an experienced Manager. He must have had good reason to make that decision, & it may well have been wrong. It's very easy for us to second guess everything through the rear view mirror though.
"Why make stupid bids that are accepted, then pull out".
What factual evidence do we have, in the domain, of all this? The overwhelming probability of what happened is that Arsenal said to Man City that morning "look, heads up guys so we can all get the medicals & documents organised, we'll accept £60 mill (or whatever the number was) for Sanchez, but it's conditional on us getting our man Lemar. No Lemar, & we can't do the deal, OK?".
If that was a dumb thing to say, then City should have ignored it.
I'm only guessing of course, as are you, but that would make perfect sense.
We saw evidence on this thread a few days ago of a call from Kroenke at 10am, but as soon as it was challenged they backtracked. Because they were guessing & had no factual evidence. Doubt we'll ever know the facts, but it's unlikely it was a "stupid bid".
"Why say someone is not for sale under any circs and then sell them"
No idea. Maybe circumstances changed, or other parties changed their stance? It does happen you know. Maybe negotiating ploys came into it. None of us can make that call without the info the Club has.
Why does he let all our top boys contracts run out so their value to us is now zero in the Xfer market, when for years it all been about making money.
A classic case of damned if he does, & damned if he does not. Whatever he did about Sanchez he was gonna get battered.
I'd not swap Arsenal's financial prudency with any other EPL Club though. And that's largely down to a bunch of wise heads, one of whom is AW.
Can't imagine anyone in their right mind would prefer Chelsea or Man City's accounting principles or source of funds to those of Arsenal.
I suspect your perception of City's accounting principles are totally skewed and probably clouded by the FFP nonsense. It is a classic business model albeit on a large scale - large initial investment, big losses in the early years but financially self-sufficient for the last 3 years. They are and have been wonderful, wonderful owners. Obviously as a City supporter we won the lottery but it is not just City supporters who have benefited but the City of Manchester as a whole with large investment in the city and the community.
This is very detailed if your are interested in the financials and written by an Arsenal fan:
http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Manchester%20City?updated-max=2016-11-22T07:17:00%2B01:00&max-results=20&start=1&by-date=false
I still love you by the way xx
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Archer
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Posts: 1053
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3077 on:
September 04, 2017, 07:43:32 PM »
Quote from: tikay on September 04, 2017, 05:57:17 PM
Quote from: Archer on September 04, 2017, 05:48:13 PM
Quote from: muckthenuts on September 04, 2017, 08:14:35 AM
List of things Arsene Knows Best:
1. How to get dominated by every team and manager inside the top 6
2. How to leave contract renewals until the final year
3. How to faff about in transfer windows
4. How to get absolutely nowhere with his own self championed British core
It's not just the Big 6
After the Big 6 you can extend it to Everton, Southampton and Stoke who have been the next most "successful" teams in the PL in terms of points accumulation for the 5 seasons from 12/13-16/17. Arsenal's away record against these 8 clubs for the same period has been woeful - just 6 wins in 40 games. Add the Stoke and Liverpool results this season into the mix and it is 6 wins from 42 games and a point average of just 0.74pts per game. Hmm, not woeful it is spectacularly bad.
Unfortunately for Arsenal they have been dealt a poor hand in terms of away fixtures this season - 3 out of their next 4 away games are against Chelsea, Everton and City. So, if the poor run (that has now lasted over 5 years) should continue over the next few away games, the "crisis" is all set to continue.
Then, as you say, there is the contract situation. The turnover in players in the next 2 years is huge. And very, very expensive...
Click to see full-size image.
A Man City fan telling another team how to manage their finances?
Yikes, the wedding is 100% off.
Looking at that list it is a huge problem. Maybe 10-12 new players in 2 years in an era when Johnny Evans is valued at £30 million and the Ox at nearly £40 million. I'm sure Arsene has got a handle on it ..
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BigAdz
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Posts: 8152
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3078 on:
September 04, 2017, 07:49:48 PM »
We all do Archer. We all do.
Fair play for putting up some challenges Tikay, but there was a heck of a lot of, 'we weren't there so we will never know ', type answers.
That would have washed 10 years ago, but the fact we have been posing similar questions for so long now, the times for benefit of the doubt, over so many of these grey decisions, is well and truly over.
You seem to keep putting your business head on when talking to fans who have no vested interest in anything other than short term results, and expecting them to see the bigger long term picture.
Fact is, I suspect you have used this for nearly ten years, to counter any AW out argument. We are nowhere near freefall yet, but if we keep missing out on proper Europe, and winning a title, we shall slowly slip further and further behind....then then numbers won't look quite so rosy, I'm sure.
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Good evenink. I wish I had a girlfriend.......
tikay
Administrator
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Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad story
«
Reply #3079 on:
September 04, 2017, 07:51:07 PM »
Quote from: Archer on September 04, 2017, 07:36:45 PM
Quote from: tikay on September 04, 2017, 05:55:15 PM
Quote from: BigAdz on September 04, 2017, 01:10:29 PM
Quote from: tikay on September 04, 2017, 11:30:02 AM
Quote from: tikay on August 25, 2017, 09:26:46 AM
Arsenal are great for the blonde post count - one unlucky defeat, in a game they utterly dominated, & it generated 3 pages of posts. Over in North London, Spurs got turned over at home & it barely generated comment, then the Man City team, which cost sixty squillion dropped a point at home to Everton & barely a word is said.
Arsenal play Liverpool on Sunday. Lose that, & blonde will have a record month for post count.
Win win.
Well maybe not a "record month", but the second consecutive defeat generated over 150 posts. The defeat to Stoke, as most neutrals would attest, was a game Arsenal dominated, the defeat to Liverpool was a real shocker, no excuses. So, whatever way we look at it, 2 consecutive defeats. They are home to Bournemouth next, lose that & blonde will explode.
Amazing how we love to finger point & celebrate failure, but ignore success. We are selective, too. Man City lost two on the bounce last December (1 of which was at home) & nobody said a word, the media was not full of "OMG, OMG, CRISIS" stuff. The Man City boys are very noisy right now over Sanchez, of course. Why? Because, for once, waving their fat chequebook failed. They are not used to that.
A 4-0 defeat generated 150 posts on the Arsenal thread, but the 4-0 win did not get a single mention on the Liverpool thread. There's a thing. It seems we really do prefer to celebrate failure, & follow the media hype.
Lets be honest. this is a load of old bollocks.
Firstly. I don't give a shit about the other teams threads, I rarely visit them, as i don't watch them and understand the nuances and issues they have. It is up to them what they moan about or celebrate
Your post refers to this thread, and i/we have celebrated several victories, most notablly the FA Cup win last season. So that's that one put to bed.
We covered our spectacular run at the end of last season, the same as the last few seasons, when all the main business has been sorted and we take advantage of everyone else being on auto pilot and try to salvage another wasted set of opportunities in the managerial merry go round.
You never seem to address the more stuble stuff Tikay, like, as GC said, and I said a while back.
Why does he leave Lacazette on the bench?
Why make stupid bids that are accepted, then pull out.
Why say someone is not for sale under any circs and then sell them
Why does he let all our top boys contracts run out so their value to us is now zero in the Xfer market, when for years it all been about making money.
Come on old chap, stop having a pop at those of us with lucid reasons for being "haters" and put us right......this isn't knee jerk for some of us, we have been saying the same thing for years, much like the results...
The floor is all yours.
"load of old bollocks"? If you wish. It was my genuine opinion actually, & I hoped we could debate constructively.
"Why does he leave Lacazette on the bench?"
I don't have the faintest idea. Chances are, as AW is an experienced Premier League Manager, & arguably a very good one in his prime,
he had good reason
. Think it would not be sensible to suggest that we, sitting in our nice comfy armchair in front of the telly, & in our ignorance of the facts & reasons, know better than an experienced Manager. He must have had good reason to make that decision, & it may well have been wrong. It's very easy for us to second guess everything through the rear view mirror though.
"Why make stupid bids that are accepted, then pull out".
What factual evidence do we have, in the domain, of all this? The overwhelming probability of what happened is that Arsenal said to Man City that morning "look, heads up guys so we can all get the medicals & documents organised, we'll accept £60 mill (or whatever the number was) for Sanchez, but it's conditional on us getting our man Lemar. No Lemar, & we can't do the deal, OK?".
If that was a dumb thing to say, then City should have ignored it.
I'm only guessing of course, as are you, but that would make perfect sense.
We saw evidence on this thread a few days ago of a call from Kroenke at 10am, but as soon as it was challenged they backtracked. Because they were guessing & had no factual evidence. Doubt we'll ever know the facts, but it's unlikely it was a "stupid bid".
"Why say someone is not for sale under any circs and then sell them"
No idea. Maybe circumstances changed, or other parties changed their stance? It does happen you know. Maybe negotiating ploys came into it. None of us can make that call without the info the Club has.
Why does he let all our top boys contracts run out so their value to us is now zero in the Xfer market, when for years it all been about making money.
A classic case of damned if he does, & damned if he does not. Whatever he did about Sanchez he was gonna get battered.
I'd not swap Arsenal's financial prudency with any other EPL Club though. And that's largely down to a bunch of wise heads, one of whom is AW.
Can't imagine anyone in their right mind would prefer Chelsea or Man City's accounting principles or source of funds to those of Arsenal.
I suspect your perception of City's accounting principles are totally skewed and probably clouded by the FFP nonsense. It is a classic business model albeit on a large scale - large initial investment, big losses in the early years but financially self-sufficient for the last 3 years. They are and have been wonderful, wonderful owners. Obviously as a City supporter we won the lottery but it is not just City supporters who have benefited but the City of Manchester as a whole with large investment in the city and the community.
This is very detailed if your are interested in the financials and written by an Arsenal fan:
http://swissramble.blogspot.co.uk/search/label/Manchester%20City?updated-max=2016-11-22T07:17:00%2B01:00&max-results=20&start=1&by-date=false
I still love you by the way xx
OK, the wedding is back on.
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All details of the 2016 Vegas Staking Adventure can be found via this link -
http://bit.ly/1pdQZDY
(copyright Anthony James Kendall, 2016).
Archer
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 1053
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3080 on:
September 04, 2017, 08:07:45 PM »
Quote from: nirvana on September 04, 2017, 12:42:07 PM
It's not far off a crisis. Say a FTSE 100 starts the year with a profit target of x and it's not cyclical. If it's down 2/3rd in month 1 with no prospect of a recovery in Q1 since their best salesman don't have any skin in the game, some others have left, and the rest are disaffected, ima fire that CEO and a few board members
This.
Back on to Sanchez. If he'd been sold on the last day for £60 million without being replaced they would have booked something like a £51.25mil profit (assuming £35mil orig fee and 3 years amortisation) and another £10mil on wages. So assuming he doesn't sign a contract and the asset value is £0 at the end of the season they have just tossed away £60million from the bottom line on a business that turns over £380mil.
But there are sporting reasons and the potential of Top 4 or higher for the CL holy grail. Top 4 last time I looked was about 6/5 so not even 50/50 to potentially earn say £45-£50mil.
P45 time in any other business.
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Karabiner
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Posts: 22737
James Webb Telescope
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3081 on:
September 04, 2017, 08:10:31 PM »
Quote from: Archer on September 04, 2017, 08:07:45 PM
Quote from: nirvana on September 04, 2017, 12:42:07 PM
It's not far off a crisis. Say a FTSE 100 starts the year with a profit target of x and it's not cyclical. If it's down 2/3rd in month 1 with no prospect of a recovery in Q1 since their best salesman don't have any skin in the game, some others have left, and the rest are disaffected, ima fire that CEO and a few board members
This.
Back on to Sanchez. If he'd been sold on the last day for £60 million without being replaced they would have booked something like a £51.25mil profit (assuming £35mil orig fee and 3 years amortisation) and another £10mil on wages. So assuming he doesn't sign a contract and the asset value is £0 at the end of the season they have just tossed away £60million from the bottom line on a business that turns over £380mil.
But there are sporting reasons and the potential of Top 4 or higher for the CL holy grail. Top 4 last time I looked was about 6/5 so not even 50/50 to potentially earn say £45-£50mil.
P45 time in any other business.
You seem to have omitted the January window in your calculations.
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"Golf is deceptively simple and endlessly complicated. It satisfies the soul and frustrates the intellect. It is at the same time maddening and rewarding and it is without a doubt the greatest game that mankind has ever invented." - Arnold Palmer aka The King.
hhyftrftdr
Hero Member
Offline
Posts: 2462
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3082 on:
September 04, 2017, 09:03:05 PM »
Quote from: Karabiner on September 04, 2017, 08:10:31 PM
Quote from: Archer on September 04, 2017, 08:07:45 PM
Quote from: nirvana on September 04, 2017, 12:42:07 PM
It's not far off a crisis. Say a FTSE 100 starts the year with a profit target of x and it's not cyclical. If it's down 2/3rd in month 1 with no prospect of a recovery in Q1 since their best salesman don't have any skin in the game, some others have left, and the rest are disaffected, ima fire that CEO and a few board members
This.
Back on to Sanchez. If he'd been sold on the last day for £60 million without being replaced they would have booked something like a £51.25mil profit (assuming £35mil orig fee and 3 years amortisation) and another £10mil on wages. So assuming he doesn't sign a contract and the asset value is £0 at the end of the season they have just tossed away £60million from the bottom line on a business that turns over £380mil.
But there are sporting reasons and the potential of Top 4 or higher for the CL holy grail. Top 4 last time I looked was about 6/5 so not even 50/50 to potentially earn say £45-£50mil.
P45 time in any other business.
You seem to have omitted the January window in your calculations.
What do you think you could get for Sanchez in January?
Ps, glad Archer has shown Tikay the light in regards to our finances and how the club is run
oil money is soooo 2011.
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Best Bitter.
TightEnd
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Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3083 on:
September 05, 2017, 09:52:02 AM »
Arsene Wenger considered leaving Arsenal 'for personal reasons' over the summer before signing two-year deal
http://dailym.ai/2gxP7nz
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I watch the world outside
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TightEnd
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Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3084 on:
September 05, 2017, 09:55:54 AM »
Arsenal plan contract talks with key players in aim to avoid another unsettling summer
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2017/09/04/arsenal-plan-contract-talks-key-players-aim-avoid-another-unsettling/
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My eyes are open wide
By the way,I made it through the day
I watch the world outside
By the way, I'm leaving out today
Karabiner
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Offline
Posts: 22737
James Webb Telescope
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3085 on:
September 08, 2017, 05:46:22 PM »
I don't expect this instagram to get much media coverage as it doen't quite fit their narrative.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BYyKaYvl8QE/
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"Golf is deceptively simple and endlessly complicated. It satisfies the soul and frustrates the intellect. It is at the same time maddening and rewarding and it is without a doubt the greatest game that mankind has ever invented." - Arnold Palmer aka The King.
tikay
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Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3086 on:
September 08, 2017, 05:59:09 PM »
Quote from: Karabiner on September 08, 2017, 05:46:22 PM
I don't expect this instagram to get much media coverage as it doen't quite fit their narrative.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BYyKaYvl8QE/
162,313 likes
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(copyright Anthony James Kendall, 2016).
Archer
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Posts: 1053
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3087 on:
September 08, 2017, 06:18:17 PM »
Quote from: Karabiner on September 08, 2017, 05:46:22 PM
I don't expect this instagram to get much media coverage as it doen't quite fit their narrative.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BYyKaYvl8QE/
so paranoid and needy
here you go:
Click to see full-size image.
Click to see full-size image.
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hhyftrftdr
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Posts: 2462
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3088 on:
September 08, 2017, 06:26:41 PM »
I thought it was us City fans who are paranoid about the media?
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Marky147
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Posts: 22796
Re: Arsenal FC a sad sad sad story
«
Reply #3089 on:
September 08, 2017, 06:34:14 PM »
Why wouldn't he be smiling?
Is he not likely to get weighed in an extra 5m+ a year, on top of what he would have gotten anyway?
Fair compo for putting up with another year chasing a Europa league spot
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