COVID19

[Marky147]

I'm quite ambivalent about all the mask stuff, and wear when required, but one of my mates is convinced it's all an NWO plot and takes great pleasure in filming himself bowling around airports/supermarkets without one, to see if anyone will challenge him

Have we got any proper graphs/studies which proves the efficacy of wearing them etc.

I'm happy enough with minimal protection for everyone from the wearer, and much the same if none from others.

Undoubtedlyt lowered by the fact half he planet can't/won't work out how to use them, and need to suck their thumb every 3 seconds when they have one on.

[Marky147]

This was an interesting listen, and talks about Slovakia's testing breaking the curve last month.

[Doobs]

I'm quite ambivalent about all the mask stuff, and wear when required, but one of my mates is convinced it's all an NWO plot and takes great pleasure in filming himself bowling around airports/supermarkets without one, to see if anyone will challenge him

Have we got any proper graphs/studies which proves the efficacy of wearing them etc.

I'm happy enough with minimal protection for everyone from the wearer, and much the same if none from others.

Undoubtedlyt lowered by the fact half he planet can't/won't work out how to use them, and need to suck their thumb every 3 seconds when they have one on.

They set a Japanese supercomputer on it and it shows they have some value, but some are better than others.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/aug/26/non-woven-masks-better-to-stop-covid-19-says-japanese-supercomputer

I think it is probably solid evidence, as the same supercomputer showed that face shields were nearly useless. 

There is some evidence in that video I linked to, where cases have been shown to drop, or the speed of spread reduced, in South Africa after compulsory mask wearing came in (it is around 54 minutes in).  He then estimates what effect it has.  You can see that he thinks reducing mobility (travel, social distancing etc) is more effective than mask wearing, but mask wearing does seem to make a siginificant difference to R. 

There have been a fair few other studies that have shown they are effective; even Which? produced best buys for face masks after testing how good they were at stopping aerosols etc.  I don't subscribe, but know there was some pretty wild variation in the effectiveness of different masks.

And surgeons have been wearing them for over a century and you'd think they'd have worked out by now if they had no effect.

But then...

there was some terrible study from Denmark that the Covid deniers have latched on to.  They had one set of people where they said wear a mask, and another set where they didn't give the instruction.  They found an improvement in those that had been told to wear a mask, but it wasn't significant.  They also found about half of those they told to wear a mask didn't comply well, and I don't think they published how many of the people they didn't ask to wear a mask ended up doing so.  It looked a bag of shit and the researchers added lots of caveats on the usefulness of the evidence they had pruduced, but they published and the usual suspects have done what they have done over and over.  Presumably it would have made Stuart McDonald's talk if it had been released earlier?

I think that mask wearing clearly has some effect, but it won't stop Covid on its own, so you need all the other stuff too (social distancing, hand washing, vaccines, not meeting indoors in badly ventilated rooms etc.)

[Marky147]

Yeah, I was under the same impression after seeing plenty of stuff from scientists. Another mate, who hates masks, keeps telling me it's not stopping the spread, and no graphs that prove they work.

The professor that did the study in Denmark even said he still thought masks were a good idea. I caught him being interviewed by the same youtube channel Gupta's video talking about her modelling was on.

Here it is:

[Marky147]

Seen a lot of this bloke the last few weeks/months, and Hartley-Brewer's Twitter gives me a migraine.

[nirvana]

I'm quite ambivalent about all the mask stuff, and wear when required, but one of my mates is convinced it's all an NWO plot and takes great pleasure in filming himself bowling around airports/supermarkets without one, to see if anyone will challenge him

Have we got any proper graphs/studies which proves the efficacy of wearing them etc.

I'm happy enough with minimal protection for everyone from the wearer, and much the same if none from others.

Undoubtedlyt lowered by the fact half he planet can't/won't work out how to use them, and need to suck their thumb every 3 seconds when they have one on.

Really odd how the mask wearing or otherwise becomes such a totem to some people. Your mate is right of course about the overall plandemic situation but, I find wearing a mask to be the least intrusive of all the lolmeasures aimed at trying to stop the disease spreading. Plus my teeth aren't great so I quite like it. Masks could save a lot of people fortunes on cosmetic surgery, Govt should focus on this aspect

[Doobs]

Surely they can find a better way of saying this?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613

But there is no evidence that vitamin D protects against or treats Covid-19, although health officials have been asked to go back over the existing research.

There is plenty of evidence it may reduce the severity of Covid, but I don't think it is absolutely proven.

The deniers spread dubious claims like wildfire and the Government discover something promising and arrange to deliver it, but at the same time tell people there is no evidence it works.  Surely you can say we think it helps without saying it is definitely proven, and without breaking any ethical code you might have?   

[Doobs]

Surely they can find a better way of saying this?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613

But there is no evidence that vitamin D protects against or treats Covid-19, although health officials have been asked to go back over the existing research.

There is plenty of evidence it may reduce the severity of Covid, but I don't think it is absolutely proven.

The deniers spread dubious claims like wildfire and the Government discover something promising and arrange to deliver it, but at the same time tell people there is no evidence it works.  Surely you can say we think it helps without saying it is definitely proven, and without breaking any ethical code you might have?   

Thinking about this more, the decisions on tiers etc are made with way less evidence than they have for the usefulness of vitamin D.  I don't even think the usefulness of Vitamin D in fighting illness is even controversial.

Somebody really cautious must look after the switchboard at the weekend when the BBC rang?  Or guess it might be just the case that the BBC has got used to putting disclaimers on things they put them in regardless?   

[DMorgan]

Its just super lol that the same people who buy a lottery ticket every week require proof of significant and immediate benefit to wear a mask

Thinking about this more, the decisions on tiers etc are made with way less evidence than they have for the usefulness of vitamin D.

I've been working at JBC (Joint Biosecurity Centre) since June as a data scientist. We're one of the organisations that crunches the numbers and suggests intervention levels. The methodology for selecting tiers will probably never be published, but my team (international assessments) published our risk assessment methodology last week, which may be of interest:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-risk-assessment-methodology-for-inbound-international-travel/covid-19-risk-assessment-methodology-for-inbound-international-travel

I would be very surprised if the methodology for assigning local authorities to tiers is much different

[Doobs]

Its just super lol that the same people who buy a lottery ticket every week require proof of significant and immediate benefit to wear a mask

Thinking about this more, the decisions on tiers etc are made with way less evidence than they have for the usefulness of vitamin D.

I've been working at JBC (Joint Biosecurity Centre) since June as a data scientist. We're one of the organisations that crunches the numbers and suggests intervention levels. The methodology for selecting tiers will probably never be published, but my team (international assessments) published our risk assessment methodology last week, which may be of interest:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-risk-assessment-methodology-for-inbound-international-travel/covid-19-risk-assessment-methodology-for-inbound-international-travel

I would be very surprised if the methodology for assigning local authorities to tiers is much different

That is interesting and hope working for the Government isn't too much of a ball ache.

I will read that later, but what I meant was the difference berween tier 2 and 3 is going to be less than a handful of cases at the margins.  Compare this to the benefits of Vitamin D where there have been multiple studies on covid plus plenty of others over the years for the benefits in similar illnesses. 

I am not saying that the reasoning behind each area going into what tier is bad, or that nobody has thought any of it through.  And there must be a whole bunch of similar marginal value judgements made in Government about this where evidence isn't very clear. 

It is just the evidence is going to be much stronger for taking Vitamin D than it is for why marginal area X should be 2 instead of 3.   Why would they send out 2.5 million Vitamin D courses if they thought there was no evidence it helped?   Somebody clearly thinks it does help and the evidence was strong enough to go through the distribution process, so why then tell people there isn't any evidence?   Now as soon as the Vitamin D goes out, the usual cranks can just point out that there is no evidence it works.  It just looks like another massive own goal.

[Pokerpops]

Its just super lol that the same people who buy a lottery ticket every week require proof of significant and immediate benefit to wear a mask

 

[Marky147]

Dr in those videos posted a fair bit about Vit D, and it can't be a stretch to think it helps. As I mention to Glenn, too much credit if you think this mob are too shar.

I'm quite ambivalent about all the mask stuff, and wear when required, but one of my mates is convinced it's all an NWO plot and takes great pleasure in filming himself bowling around airports/supermarkets without one, to see if anyone will challenge him

Have we got any proper graphs/studies which proves the efficacy of wearing them etc.

I'm happy enough with minimal protection for everyone from the wearer, and much the same if none from others.

Undoubtedlyt lowered by the fact half he planet can't/won't work out how to use them, and need to suck their thumb every 3 seconds when they have one on.

Really odd how the mask wearing or otherwise becomes such a totem to some people. Your mate is right of course about the overall plandemic situation but, I find wearing a mask to be the least intrusive of all the lolmeasures aimed at trying to stop the disease spreading. Plus my teeth aren't great so I quite like it. Masks could save a lot of people fortunes on cosmetic surgery, Govt should focus on this aspect

I don't like them, but wear them because I know how worried some people are, and I'm not trying to get myself onto the news when I rock up for infusion and upset the other patiens in the ward by refusing to wear one. Added bonus that there might be some efficacy in protecting when in a closed environment.

As for the plandemic, I think looking at how much of a balls up we've made, along with Cheeto's army. You're giving them far too much credit for having the ability to plan anything

[Marky147]

I just topped up on all my Magnesium, Vit B/D when Bulkpowders had a 75% off sale. Just my luck!

I take 15,000iu a day of Vit D, so not sure the kiddies doses they're handing out are much good to me

[Marky147]

Dr John must have almost as dull a social life as me the amount of time he spends grafting at this.

[Doobs]

Surely they can find a better way of saying this?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55108613

But there is no evidence that vitamin D protects against or treats Covid-19, although health officials have been asked to go back over the existing research.

There is plenty of evidence it may reduce the severity of Covid, but I don't think it is absolutely proven.

The deniers spread dubious claims like wildfire and the Government discover something promising and arrange to deliver it, but at the same time tell people there is no evidence it works.  Surely you can say we think it helps without saying it is definitely proven, and without breaking any ethical code you might have?   

Ha, they have changed it now to "limited evidence" from "no evidence".   They still seem to be a bit too pessimistic, but at least they must have listened to someone.