COVID19

[kukushkin88]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

Stephen Powis still saying 20,000, we won’t be far off that by this Monday morning (when the ONS update up to 13/04).

Seems mad that it was only a few days ago that they said 7,000 to 20,000 only a few days ago.   It is as unfathomable as when they kept saying it doubled every 5/6 days when it was clearly doubling in less than 3 days.

Anyway, good to see the deaths are starting to level off a bit.   I think schools will be back by half term, though I am struggling to see an end game.  Surely going back to normal before a vaccine just means cases doubling every 3 days again.   Some sort of quasi social distancing may work in the sticks longer term but how do you keep away from other people on a rush hour train/tube?

Really?

Over here we have just had our first two deaths (a 92 & 89 year old) around 250 cases (guess) and our schools are closed til the new school year. I would be amazed if schools opened there in 10 days?

It is Easter here, half term is the end of May.   I just think schools reopen before other things start as the released documents suggest they think it is lower risk than other actions.  Presumably they can partially reopen without the exam cohorts?  There is no point in bringing years 11 and 13 back as there are no GCSEs or A levels?   Just thinking how I'd do it.  

That's what I've read this past week, after May half term at the latest supported by Union of Headteachers and most of the government. As you say sounds like one of the first restrictions they want to lift here.

I had a look at news reports on this. It seems this story first came up 4 days ago some of the wording used is,
"In an interview with Schools Week, NAHT general secretary Paul Whiteman suggested that schools should reopen as soon as it is safe to do so.

We haven’t seen any indication yet that the requirements of social distancing are such that things will change for schools in the short term,’ he said. ‘That said, once the scientific advice is that schools can return safely, they should do so, even if it’s for a very limited period before the summer break, as this will allow young people to reacquaint themselves with the educational environment."

with the government response being,
"A spokesman for the Department for Education said: ‘Schools will remain closed until further notice, except for children of critical workers and the children who are most vulnerable. ‘We will reopen schools when the scientific advice indicates it is safe to do so.’"

That was in the Guardian, the exact story then got picked up by other outlets a couple of days ago and repeated.

And on the Today programme Paul Cosford, a director of Public Health England, was asked about it.

"Asked directly about the idea, he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme: "All those are the sort of things that will need to be considered and are being considered."
...
Asked directly if schools could open in a first wave of easing restrictions, he said: “Maybe. Some countries are looking at that. Other countries are looking at different ways of doing this.”

However, Prof Cosford also warned we have an “awfully long way to go” before any restrictions are lifted at all, and “several weeks isn’t unreasonable. Let’s hope it’s sooner than that.”

To me it seems a lot like some in education are saying, "we'd like to reopen as soon as possible" and some in the government are saying, "yes that would be good".

From the evidence we have so far I think it's possible schools could partially re-open after half term, but I think we'd need to see more than we have at the moment. e.g. if deaths started a clear downward trajectory as well as spare ICU capacity steadily increasing.


EDIT: obviously extra sources with other evidence is always welcome

It remains the case that we don’t have evidence of the role children play in spreading, the key will be their role in asymptomatic spread.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(20)30095-X/fulltext

I would be surprised if the schools open again this academic year, the picture in the UK compared to our European counterparts will be muddled by how limited our lockdown is. It seems construction workers are going back to work in Spain this week, that will provide another key piece of data to learn from.

Fixed the link now.

[nirvana]

Found this to be a rational, expert and somewhat reassuring perspective from Bill Gates

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0896rpg

[kukushkin88]

Found this to be a rational, expert and somewhat reassuring perspective from Bill Gates

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0896rpg

Yep, really valuable insight. The Netflix documentary about him is really good. He is dramatically different, in a fantastic way (I’m a bit biased, as I almost automatically love people who are notably different), to every other person that I am aware of.

[nirvana]

Found this to be a rational, expert and somewhat reassuring perspective from Bill Gates

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p0896rpg

Yep, really valuable insight. The Netflix documentary about him is really good. He is dramatically different, in a fantastic way (I’m a bit biased, as I almost automatically love people who are notably different), to every other person that I am aware of.

Hadn't seen that was on there, will watch it

[kukushkin88]

Any confusion Diane Abbott ever had with numbers gets knocked straight out of the park. It would be front page news if Abbot did this:

https://twitter.com/eframage/status/1249025867138859011?s=21

[kukushkin88]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

One of the few decent remaining journalists explains it well:

https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21

[kukushkin88]

Any confusion Diane Abbott ever had with numbers gets knocked straight out of the park. It would be front page news if Abbot did this:

https://twitter.com/eframage/status/1249025867138859011?s=21

To be clear though, it’s not really important whether or not a politician can say a number:

https://twitter.com/femi_sorry/status/1249031717098315776?s=21

[Woodsey]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

Morbid whingebag I like that 

[kukushkin88]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

Morbid whingebag I like that  
[/]

A weird quoting fail, must have accidentally deleted a bracket somewhere.

One of the few remaining decent journalists explains it well.

[url][https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21/url]

Since you’re here, we also shouldn’t disregard the extent to which our response has been influenced by how much our country has been enfeebled, both economically and politically, by Brexit.

[Woodsey]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

Morbid whingebag I like that  
[/]

A weird quoting fail, must have accidentally deleted a bracket somewhere.

One of the few remaining decent journalists explains it well.

[url][https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21/url]

Since you’re here, we also shouldn’t disregard the extent to which our response has been influenced by how much our country has been enfeebled, both economically and politically, by Brexit.

As has been said a few times one way or another, now isn’t the time for being a morbid wingebag and criticising just for the sake of it because you don’t like the Tories. Let what happen happen and it will all come out in the wash later......

You even fked up the quoting thing for me.......

[kukushkin88]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

Morbid whingebag I like that  
[/]

A weird quoting fail, must have accidentally deleted a bracket somewhere.

One of the few remaining decent journalists explains it well.

[url][https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21/url]

Since you’re here, we also shouldn’t disregard the extent to which our response has been influenced by how much our country has been enfeebled, both economically and politically, by Brexit.

As has been said a few times one way or another, now isn’t the time for being a morbid wingebag and criticising just for the sake of it because you don’t like the Tories. Let what happen happen and it will all come out in the wash later......

The only thing that the link I posted is doing, is explaining, from first hand experience, why that view is nonsense.

[Woodsey]

"Will you apologise......" questions even top the inanity of "shouldn't you have done x sooner" questions.

The demanding an apology is inane, I agree. They’re going to have to get used to the ‘sooner’ question though. Even now, we could still implement a lockdown. I’m surprised you thought that point from the Swedish epidemiologist was clever, it really isn’t, all that anybody means when criticising a failure to act ‘sooner’, is inexplicably waiting to act, it’s perfectly valid. In the next 10 days we will be well clear for most deaths in Europe (and 2nd most known in the world), so people won’t stop asking the ‘sooner’ question.

Still no improvement in the government trotting out massively wrong numbers, with no explanation for why they’re wrong. Can’t they just watch Sturgeon and see how easy it is?

I don't think it's clever. I just think the line of why didn't you do something is pointless. It doesn't achieve anything that helps us into the future. In the future there may be legitimate reasons for a forensic review of decision making every step of the way. In fact I'm sure there will be, but even that will be better done by people with some expertise rather than journos.

Exactly that. Do the handwringing later, lets focus on getting through as best we can.

Morbid whingebags can always find something to moan about on yahoo.

Morbid whingebag I like that  
[/]

A weird quoting fail, must have accidentally deleted a bracket somewhere.

One of the few remaining decent journalists explains it well.

[url][https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21/url]

Since you’re here, we also shouldn’t disregard the extent to which our response has been influenced by how much our country has been enfeebled, both economically and politically, by Brexit.

As has been said a few times one way or another, now isn’t the time for being a morbid wingebag and criticising just for the sake of it because you don’t like the Tories. Let what happen happen and it will all come out in the wash later......

The only thing that the link I posted is doing, is explaining, from first hand experience, why that view is nonsense.

I’m not referring to one particular post or link, just generally over the last few weeks.

[kukushkin88]

What did I do to the quote function? Let’s not post to that chain again.

[Woodsey]

What did I do to the quote function? Let’s not post like a morbid whingebag again.

FYP

[kukushkin88]

The link is explaining why we shouldn’t wait. The time to scrutinise why our response is give or take the world’s worsts so far is now. Afterwards the Tory machine will be all out for ‘that was bad chaps but let’s move on’.

https://twitter.com/carolecadwalla/status/1249247210287570944?s=21