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Poll
Question: Do you agree that Scotland should be an independent country?
Yes - because it would be better for the Scots
Yes - because the rest of the UK would be better off without the Scots
Don't really know
Don't care
No, the Union is a good thing

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Author Topic: Independence Referendum  (Read 189959 times)
OverTheBorder
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« Reply #960 on: September 11, 2014, 11:00:48 AM »

Much of what I am seeing on social media this morning and from various conversations I have had last night and this morning the news that the likes of RBS/LBG want to leave is welcomed.  We are in the mess we are in mostly because of the casino banking operations. 

I can't imagine any no supporters have continued to follow you on social media. I have seen the complete opposite.

As Glenn said you have all the working class votes you are going to get. You need to convince the various middle classes and telling then business going South is good is not going to do that.
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TightEnd
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« Reply #961 on: September 11, 2014, 11:11:05 AM »

Much of what I am seeing on social media this morning and from various conversations I have had last night and this morning the news that the likes of RBS/LBG want to leave is welcomed.  We are in the mess we are in mostly because of the casino banking operations. 

Scotland, and the UK as a whole, is not in a worse mess because the bank of England prevented the Scottish banks from collapsing by injecting significant liquidity into them to keep them afloat during the banking crisis

Without that we would have seen mass unemployment, and a severe depression borne of much higher borrowing costs 

It's of course fine to have a desire for independence driven by romantic views of a separate Scottish identity and culture but its not driven by cold economic logic.

with respect, what you are likely to read on social media and in conversations with friends will massively downplay the economics and massively upscale the romance of it but as the companies are showing, their position is in many cases the reverse
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AndrewT
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« Reply #962 on: September 11, 2014, 11:13:05 AM »

Much of what I am seeing on social media this morning and from various conversations I have had last night and this morning the news that the likes of RBS/LBG want to leave is welcomed.  We are in the mess we are in mostly because of the casino banking operations. 

The social media you see and the conversations you have is going to be a Yes echo chamber.
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Kmac84
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« Reply #963 on: September 11, 2014, 11:20:03 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?

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david3103
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« Reply #964 on: September 11, 2014, 11:24:37 AM »

Much of what I am seeing on social media this morning and from various conversations I have had last night and this morning the news that the likes of RBS/LBG want to leave is welcomed.  We are in the mess we are in mostly because of the casino banking operations. 

The social media you see and the conversations you have is going to be a Yes echo chamber.

Absolutely this. You seem to have shut your eyes and ears to any debate. Your blind faith that everything will be possible and that the future of an independent Scotland will be full of economic prosperity and full employment is bewildering to me. How can you argue for the Yes vote when you aren't seeing or hearing the evidence for the No side?

This summed it up for me
Right, thats that sorted then.  Give me strength. 

KMac seriously what is your problem?

The UK is, of course, a country. So is Scotland, so is England, so is Wales. You can dig around semantics to find a definition of "country" which doesn't fit the UK or any of the others. Does it really matter??? Really???

What matters more to me is sifting through the bullshit that is put about by both sides of this debate. The biggest difference is that if you criticise anything, yes anything, about the yes side you are somehow Un-Scottish. Can you not even begin to see how offensive that is to those of us that dare to disagree with the view put forward by the SNP?

I was expecting some kind of dissection of the article I linked to earlier, which explains a lot about how the SNP operate, but no, not a word. So I guess you just don't like it. or maybe you actually agree with it. 

You assume I agree with the view put forward by the SNP.  A silly trait by unionists is to suggest that only the SNP support independence.  

I never read the article you posted.  
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« Reply #965 on: September 11, 2014, 11:26:08 AM »

Much of what I am seeing on social media this morning and from various conversations I have had last night and this morning the news that the likes of RBS/LBG want to leave is welcomed.  We are in the mess we are in mostly because of the casino banking operations. 

with the Banks head office going to London it would make it easier for currency union but you still have to give up some of your sovereignty as stated by Mark Carney
http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/sep/09/currency-union-independent-scotland-unworkable-bank-governor

the real problem is that this is bad for Scotland , even having a Scotish Pound linked is not great , you need your own currency to have full control ie: print money & control inflation & then you would have a chance to create new jobs & bring new business & investments into Scotland with tax breaks like the smaller countries with in the EU does , without your own currency its unlikely you will be able to rejoin the EU & will have to pay the European Economic Area like Norway/Iceland does & even the UK will have to if they leave the EU , to the UK this would cost several billion a year if the torries get their way

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TightEnd
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« Reply #966 on: September 11, 2014, 11:27:24 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



central banks around the world helped prevent meltdown in 2009-13. Of course their role in the deregulation of financial markets (Greenspan in the 1980s notably but also Labour in 1997 here) in the first place is the other side of the coin

they aren't throwing their toys out of the pram it is a NECESSITY to be backed by the Bank of England, hence the announcements yesterday

Neither were they single handedly responsible for the last recession.

RBOS has liabilities 12x the size of Scottish GDP now, the global recovery is underway so no real short term problems

but without the BOE being a lender of last resort their funding costs rise dramatically, and this passes on hugely to anyone with a RBS loan, mortgage etc 

with another downturn, without the BOE behind it it could go, that could mean a financial disaster for Scotland.

So they need to move and for Mr Salmond to claim they are "scaremongering" is just anodyne PR for his own supporters and floating voters.
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DungBeetle
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« Reply #967 on: September 11, 2014, 11:30:16 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



UK government bailed out the UK banks (except Barclays who I believe managed to get a helping hand from the Gulf).  US government helped out Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan etc.

The banks clearly overstepped the mark, but longer term they are a strong source of employment and tax revenue for our respective countries.
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david3103
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« Reply #968 on: September 11, 2014, 11:33:25 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



Incorrect on so many levels.

Try this to get some feel of how wrong

http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/2013/01/prosecuting-financial-crisis

Although I guess it's pointless pointing you in the direction of facts that run counter to your beliefs
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« Reply #969 on: September 11, 2014, 11:33:54 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



Well almost, if it wasn't for the massive structural current account defecit we had, badly controlled government spending, the sheer size of our National debt, the collapse of the Southern European economies, and that great big stinking pensions time bomb.   Easier to blame those wankers who ran the banks though.  Hell we may as well carry on blaming them long after they left.

Of course there is no denying RBS were winners in the most badly run bank competition, though HBOS, Bradford and Binglkey and Northern Rock provided some pretty stiff competition.  
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Kmac84
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« Reply #970 on: September 11, 2014, 11:34:55 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



UK government bailed out the UK banks (except Barclays who I believe managed to get a helping hand from the Gulf).  US government helped out Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan etc.

The banks clearly overstepped the mark, but longer term they are a strong source of employment and tax revenue for our respective countries.

US Federal reserve pumped hundreds of millions into RBS and Barclays also. 
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TightEnd
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« Reply #971 on: September 11, 2014, 11:38:05 AM »

So it wasn't the American's that heped bail out UK banks?

Just to be clear RBS were almost single handedly responsible for bringing financial meltdown upon these islands with casino banking and we are supposed to feel remorse when they decide to throw their toys out the plan and threaten to leave?



UK government bailed out the UK banks (except Barclays who I believe managed to get a helping hand from the Gulf).  US government helped out Morgan Stanley, JP Morgan etc.

The banks clearly overstepped the mark, but longer term they are a strong source of employment and tax revenue for our respective countries.

US Federal reserve pumped hundreds of millions into RBS and Barclays also. 

just as well too.

RBOS's big activities on the East coast, Citizens and Charter one meant the Fed got involved

For Barclays likewise, big US operations

HBOS, Lloyds etc, more domestic bailouts
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« Reply #972 on: September 11, 2014, 11:46:24 AM »

It was only a few weeks/ months away that salmonella and his troops were going on about our great historic banks and banking sector and how Edinburgh  could become a new hotbed for investment and a new stock exchange  formed etc etc

But now a few firms have decided to pull out it's good riddance were better off without them,
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« Reply #973 on: September 11, 2014, 11:49:37 AM »

http://wingsoverscotland.com/if-newspapers-told-the-truth-for-one-day/
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« Reply #974 on: September 11, 2014, 11:53:53 AM »


Ooh the irony

Anybody else always reminded of the Nazi Eagle when visiting that site?
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